Star Trek Vs. Star Wars Franchise Face-Off

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[00:00:58] Five is the greatest show ever. I loved Land of the Giants, man. It was so cool. Stargate is amazing. Lost in Space was so great. Earth above and beyond, man. Earth 2 was so cool. Nobody can beat the prisoner, though. Oh, the prisoner's the best. No, SeaQuest. Guys, SeaQuest, come on. SeaQuest problem.

[00:01:27] Why can't we have them all? Sequest or let's take Roy Strider out and put in Michael Ironside and no one's going to know the difference. If you think about it, it's Jaws in the Ocean in the future. Yeah, Sequest was a great series. Its only problem is that... Not enough Michael Ironside. No, not that. No, I like the layout. Like, they switched up the crews every season. That was smart. Yeah.

[00:01:53] But it really did kind of detract from the story, too. It's like, you got Roy Scheider leading things off. And it's like, great, cool. It's partly because they all got sold on one show and then they changed it. It was more Monster of the Week was the problem. Yeah. Yeah. And Scheider and everybody were like, eh, it's not what I signed on for. It's the Space 1999 conundrum. Yep. Yes, it is. Basically it. All right. So, gang, we're in a hell of a pickle here.

[00:02:20] You know, we defeated who would win best slasher franchise, Freddy or Jason. But, you know, now we got a new quandary. We got to squash all the geeks and nerds everywhere and let them know which space opera is more boss than the other. So.

[00:02:58] Battlestar Galactica. There you go. Let's go. Let's go. For Gil Gerard. I'm sorry. Motorization for Gil Gerard. Mystery Science Theater 3000. Anyway. I've always been a Spaceballs fan myself. Awesome. There you go. Galaxy Quest. I don't know. So. Babylon 5 for life. Yep. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. If it is still bad, we will ask this awesome question that Tom came up with, which will actually end the fight perfectly.

[00:03:28] So. But for now, I'm just going to circle around because we got 15 occupants. So it's already, even though it's got to be an even number, it's an odd number. We'll find a way. So I'm going to circle around who of the OG era was better. The original Star Trek show and their six movies or the original Star Wars trilogy and E.T. E.T. E.T. You don't remember? He's part of the Synod in Phantom Menace. Anyway. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway. Come on. It's not that far stretched.

[00:03:58] Anyway. So Matt, what are you going to vote? Matt Soto. Yes. Sorry. Okay. I got to say Trek. All right. And yeah. It can be just simple responses or you can just say just like that. Just slap it there. It's like, nope. Only Trek. Trek. I'm going to say Trek. Oh, so Tony is going with Trek. Perfect. James, what say you?

[00:04:25] As much as I have loved the prequels and the original trilogy, and that's my childhood right there. I'm going to have to say Trek because I had rewatched it while I was off last week from work. And I got more and more into it. The more I got into it, the more I realized it was better writing. And it's two different things you have to look at. Star Wars was not meant to be a weekly TV show. Star Trek was.

[00:04:52] Star Trek had writers like DC Fontana. You know, they had really good scripts. And I'm going to have to say Trek. I'm sorry. Didn't Fontana work for DC Comics at one point? Yes. DC Fontana? Yeah, she did. She's actually a friend of friends. A friend's husband's aunt. Well, shit. It's a small world. All right. Perfect. I said Trek. I just find Khan just way more epic than Empire. Leslie, not Crusher.

[00:05:21] What would you say is the better franchise? Oh, without a doubt. Star Trek. Okay. Perfect. Yep. I love how you guys are making this so easy. Why can't we be this fucking easy? This is the first question, Cam. You need to get better. I know. I will. I'm going to need it because math are hard. Gil, with this early era, which one are you more loyal to? Well, I'm going to keep going with the same thing. It's Trek. All right. Perfect.

[00:05:51] Mike and not mechanic. What do you think? Star Trek, the original set. They just had better stories. The show alone. Perfect. More imagination. Those volume of stories, too. They had a lot more stories to tell. Yeah. Love it. All right, Litwin. Where are you going on this? It's a struggle. When you say opera, it creates the operatics, and you'd have to say Star Wars. But, as everybody has pointed out, just the fact that there is so much more Trek and the original show

[00:06:18] is just so much more of a thing that Star Trek, I mean, Star Wars never had. So, I'm going to have to say Trek. All right. Perfect. This is just so wild. It usually just goes back and forth, and no one can make up their mind. I love it. Making it easy. All right. Travis. So, I think of this like I think of you. You mentioned slashers, and for me, Halloween is the best slasher movie, but it's the weakest franchise.

[00:06:42] I think Star Wars has the single best one in Empire for me, but volume and just overall that era, Star Trek, hands down. Man. For the roof. I don't even have to do math on this part. Jesus. So, Charlie, what are you thinking? I guess I will be the dissenter. I will go with Star Wars. I also think it helps that I'm getting E.T. in this, and if we're really going to be in Raiders of the Lost Ark,

[00:07:08] when they zoom in in Egypt, you also have C-3PO and R.C.P.U. there. So, I guess I feel like I got to go with Star Wars then. Whatever makes you think. You sound like drunk Chewbacca. Who let the dogs out? Now it's becoming the Swedish.

[00:07:37] All righty. I love it, man. You just swept the leg there. So, Jason, who do you think is the better of these picks? I mean, they're very different. One's really sci-fi. One's more fantasy. Why do you think we're here? As much as Star Wars dominated my childhood, I'm drinking from this for a reason. Oh. Star Trek. One drink to beam up. Sam. Samwise Gamgee. What do you think?

[00:08:02] I'm going to say Star Wars because I just watched Genesis 2, Planet Earth, and Strange New World because of Jason. And I don't want anything more to do with any Roddenberry remixes or any of his damn... Yes, what? So, Oreo, which way are you going to vote on these original selection? I know you don't like one of them, but you kind of like E.T. I mean, E.T.'s okay, but there's not much to it. So, Trek.

[00:08:32] All righty. Tom. I'm going with Trek for a reason nobody else has ever commented on yet. The Undiscovered Country. Yes. That, hands down, is an underrated classic. Five-star movie. Just talked about it in the original Klingon. Political. Yeah. I love it. When everyone says Trek can't be political, it's like, oh, did you see Undiscovered Country? So, Roger. Roger, Roger. Yeah. It's going to be almost a clean sweep.

[00:09:02] Star Trek it is. Okay. Thanks for making my math easy. Man. I can't math the math. I just re-watched the first season, and I can't believe how well written it is because, you know, it's what I haven't seen in a while, and you go back and re-watch. Incredible writing that first season. Perfect. All right. So, 13 votes is going to squash the two oppositions, and Trek is the winner in the OG era. Perfect. So, we're to the next generation of both eras.

[00:09:31] We got four next-gen films, four TV shows, next-gen, DS9, Voyager, and Enterprise, versus the Star Wars prequel, and that Clone Wars CGI cartoon movie no one saw. I did. Well. I saw the movie first. That was, fuck, that was amazing in theaters. Better yet, let's have a show of hands. All in favor of the Star Trek shows, if any of them. Just, at least one of them has your vote. Okay. Correct.

[00:09:59] So, Matt, Mike, Roger, Jason, Travis, and Gil. No video for me, but I'm voting for Star Trek also. Okay. Am I? TNG. I mean, in this. Keep your hands up, please. All right. In that era, how can you not? It's. Okay. So. Once you get past season one of TNG, it just gets great. Oh, cute. I can't, I can't do that. All right. James. Tony. All right. No, with me. With me. Yes.

[00:10:29] Here we go. It's TNG. All right. I'm going to go prequels. Oh. Okay. Okay. Cool. Cool. So, just Sam and James are voting for Star Wars. Okay. Cool. My opinion is this. Perfect. I get it. Better effects. The story we had wanted to know since we were kids about how Anakin became Darth Vader. Plus, you got to realize we're, as Star Wars fans, you know, we're all chomping at the bit going like, okay, when's he going to do another one? When's he going to do another one?

[00:10:57] And Tom, you were also voting for Wars or? I voted for Trek. Okay. Perfect. Awesome. And I'll tell you why. It was the second movie of the prequel trilogy. I love that one. That was so full of holes that I just cannot work them. I was turned off of the Star Wars prequels from the first one, actually. Right. No, it's fine. And since First Contact is a five-star classic, it is going to get the win. Right. I mean, it's also like just straight volume, right?

[00:11:27] You know, at that point, we may just draw the line here. The line must be drawn here. All right. So now we're at movie relaunch era where we got the Trek Kelvin reboot trilogy or the Star Wars sequel trilogy and the two spinoff movies, Rogue One and Solo. Oh, Christ. I'm not voting for either. I'm writing in a vote for The Expanse on this one. Wait, we can do that? Oh, no. Don't do that. Please don't. He's altered the deal.

[00:11:57] Pray he does not alter it. It's just for a joke. It's just for a joke. I'm not voting is what I'm saying. I mean, specifically for this one as well, too. So. Sorry, but just so I'm clear, we're talking about the sequel trilogy and what for Star Trek? The. Reboots. The Abrams reboots. The Kelvin arrow. All right. So if you don't like either, you do not have to vote.

[00:12:22] And so I just like in the last month, rewatched the three Kelvin timeline films. All right. And first of all, they are really, I really enjoyed them, but they're also Star Wars liked. Right. It's Abrams being like, hey, I can make a Star Wars movie, but they're slapping Star Trek on it. So let me do Star Wars. And then he got to do Star Wars a couple of years later. Right. Other than Spark, it's related to name only. Yeah. So.

[00:12:50] Star Trek Beyond was the best out of that trilogy. It was absolutely was hands down. Yeah, definitely. And the week one for me. So. Yeah. The week, what I thought was that one where they reversed the Kahn Noonian sin story. And that was, that was nostalgia baiting gone too far. And that bothered me. Overall, I like, I still enjoyed the movie. I remember going to see it in the theater, but at the same time, like it just didn't land.

[00:13:17] But the, the, the Star Wars sequel trilogy, while it's got plenty of faults of its own. Yeah. Felt more in line with what Star Wars was for me. So like in this instance, I'm voting Star Wars. Oh, no. Yeah. Oh, okay. Hey. I like how you just came around at the end. You're like, whoa. Okay. The thing is, you also throw in Solo and Rogue One and Rogue One is phenomenal. And Solo, I feel is underrated. I think it's a lot better than a lot of people. Yeah. I can't lose.

[00:13:47] You're still on that. No, that's fine. So which one are you voting for, James? I'm going to go with Star Wars. I mean, even though, you know, Rise of Skywalker, I am not really a big fan of. The thing that got me the most was, okay. It brought, the thing with Star Trek, the Abrams, was that it was just a lot of it was like rewriting, rewriting. Okay. We've got another timeline now. And the only thing I really enjoyed about the timeline was that they brought in Leonard Nimoy.

[00:14:16] Kind of was like a, you know, an anchor for when he was around, you know, for that original era. Just like bringing Arnold into a bad Terminator sequel. It's still kind of similar. But the thing with Star Wars was that, you know, 2005, you got to realize it was nine, nine, 10 years, nine years after we'd seen, you know, Revenge of the Sith. Now what's happened afterwards, you know, after the, you know, is there a public story?

[00:14:46] The story was good. As I said, you know, Sky, you know, Rise of Skywalker. I, you know, there are some great parts in there, but it's not that good of a movie. But I'm going to say this. Rogue One was the link to the original movie. If you look at the way they did that movie, they basically, the way they keep going. He's going to keep messing with you. And Klingon, kiss him out, took a shot on. All right. Oh my God. Man.

[00:15:15] Star Wars, Rogue One, and Solo was a great movie too. And I'm sorry they didn't get to make the Rogue Squadron movie that they were supposed to. All right. Ryan, how are you, buddy? Fantastic. How are you? Very good. So you made it late to the polls. That lately we missed two questions. All right. Yeah. Jesus. I don't.

[00:15:45] Wow. Okay. Just say Trek twice and you're okay. I don't like candy, man. So we got 16 occupants. So we'll make this quick. OG Star Wars trilogy or OG Star Trek TOS movies and show. Which one would you think is a better one? Star Wars. Still doesn't win, but hey, it's interesting. And then are you going to go with the next gen Trek films and the four shows that followed? Or are you going to go with the Star Wars prequels? Star Wars prequels.

[00:16:14] All right. So there are free. Still doesn't win. And so now we're during the movie relaunch session. Do you care for the sequel trilogy? Or do you like the Kelvin trilogy a little more? I would rather watch my parents have sex than watch the Star Wars sequels. Okay. So that is going to be for Trek or nay? I don't know any of the new Trek. Okay. So none.

[00:16:45] So I'm not going to lie to the Trek fans here and say, oh yeah, Trek. And I'm going to give you guys the point. I'm sure they're fantastic. But seriously, I'd rather sit next to my father giving me play-by-play of the night I was conceived. All right. The Star Wars sequels. All right. Let's keep it PG here. After we've said every word on the planet. So. I know. I'm just fucking with you. Anyway. So Roger. Roger, Roger. Which era? What's your effect, Victor?

[00:17:14] It's a tough one because I do love. I brought up a bunch of stuff. The Rogue One. I love this movie. It's so good. But I don't think it's enough. I don't think that movie alone is because the three sequels of Star Wars are just awful. Like, again, yeah, I couldn't. I can't bear them. So I don't think this one movie. You only need to. Right. All righty. Hey. So. I liked Rogue One, but I didn't give my vote to Eider Era because they overall suck. So. All right.

[00:17:42] And whoever said also about Solo was correct. Very underrated film. I think it's way too much hate that it deserves. I agree with that. Solo and Rogue One, I will give credit for those two movies. Yeah. Solo just got a lot of hate for no reason. Like. I just couldn't see anything. The only issue I had with Solo was that it didn't need to be made. All right. But it was made. So it was good. I mean, the only thing with Solo that I didn't love was the whole idea of how he got his name felt very forced. That felt.

[00:18:12] Actually, that felt very George Lucas is what that felt. That was an Ivan Reitman. And not in the right way. Fair enough. But so much about that movie was really good. Can't win them all. I'm going to go with the new Trek because the Star Wars stuff was just straight up fan service. It wasn't anything new. It was just reproduced for every one of those. So Trek was a little more easy. If you're into it or not into it, you could still enjoy it. Star Wars, you had to be into it to enjoy all the side jokes. I think Trek's the winner in those ones.

[00:18:42] Fair enough. All right. Jason Voorhees. What do you think? Just for Rogue One alone, I got to go with Star Wars. All right. I do enjoy the Kelvins. They're not great, but they're not terrible. Rogue One was amazing. This is wild. So this is, man, this is where it really goes to shit. No one can agree on this era. All right. So Tony. Yeah, I'm going to go with Star Wars on this one. All right. The lightsabers are enough. Leslie.

[00:19:10] Well, I got to tell you, it's really, for me personally, a tie because I thought there were good things. No, no, no. I've made my decision. I have made my decision. But there were good things and bad things about both. But you really, you just, you had to say, you had to throw in the Rogue One. And Rogue One is what just barely put me over that edge to say where I'm going to just have to go with Star Wars. I thought the trilogy was trash. It was a cash grab from Disney.

[00:19:38] But Rogue One was stellar. Everything about it. Loved it. And the TV show Andor. Oh, my God. I love that TV show. So I'm a huge Rogue One fan. So I have to go with that. Fair enough. Yeah. All right, Tom. I know you're not too crazy about either of these. Where are you going to land? Well, actually, I'm going to side with Trek for a couple of reasons. One, Eric Bana as Romulan.

[00:20:08] Perfect casting. The second thing is, I had to take points away from Star Wars because Episode 7 was basically Episode 4. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Episode 7 was really the entire trilogy retooled. Basically, yeah. Yeah. It was. But for me, like, that worked because it was the, hey, hey, we can still do this thing. Remember these movies? These were good. Here you go. Now, the problem was that then they let them go in a different...

[00:20:35] They let Rian Johnson make his own Star Wars movie and then pulled both hamstrings trying to back away from that movie and give us Rise of Skywalker. And that was... Top of the Masters. Yep. That was not a rose Tico. Good movie. I will give credit to Last Jedi for one thing. I did appreciate he was trying to go in a different direction. Yeah. And he kept saying, like, we're going to kill this off. We're going to end this. We're going to... And then... I don't remember how it did in the... I think it did pretty well in the box. But I think when J.J. Abrams got back, he went, fuck, what do I do now?

[00:21:05] He just killed Snoke off. He did this. He did that. I'm like, I got to fix all this. But there was so much stuff in Last Jedi that made no sense. And there was no point in being there. The casino planet. Having Benicio Del Toro. That was the perfect spot to bring Lando in. And they didn't do it. It was just... If they would have ended that movie when Luke walks out in front of all the fucking New Order, that shot when you just see him and looking at her. If they would have ended the movie there, that would have been the greatest Star Wars ever made.

[00:21:34] But they didn't. They kept going with it. Instead, we got Princess Leia flying through space. Yep. And dying to add insult to injury. All right. So, Charlie, where do you land? I'm going with Star Trek. There are some things I like about Star Wars. I did really like Rogue One, especially the Darth Vader hallway scene at the end. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I think that Star Wars has higher highs of the movies you mentioned and far lower lows.

[00:22:03] So, I'm going to go with the consistency of the three Star Trek movies. Fair enough. They did have a good cast. I will give it that. By the way, getting Vader being Vader at the end of Rogue One was awesome. And Solo gave us Chewbacca being Chewy. Like, Chewbacca kicking ass was something that I had wanted to see since I was five years old. And I got to see it in Solo. It was so restricted to the video games for the longest time. You're like, I want to see them do that on screen. Oreo. You like a bit of both.

[00:22:32] But where do you ultimately land? I picked the sequels and spinoffs, but I do not care for Rogue One. Solo is good in book form. And the sequel trilogy is also good in book form. They're good in book and movie form. But man, I just don't care for the fan service in Rogue One. It was such trash. All right. Fair enough. Gil, you are especially divided on this. Not really. No. Okay.

[00:23:02] I mean, I was okay with Solo and Rogue One, but I had more fun with Star Trek's Kelvin universe and the recasting of all the old original crew. It's a good cast. Yeah. What is Star Trek versus Star Wars? Star Trek Beyond is the best distillation of that among all of those sequel things. Fair enough. Litwin. I know you're also divided on this whole franchise, but where do you ultimately land? You really are comparing like spam and fermented fish balls here.

[00:23:32] Jesus. Okay. If you don't like either, you can tap out and say, I'm good. There's also positives too. I mean, you got one hand, you have like all the prequel and sequels are basically just, you know, garbage fire where you're trying to throw money on it to put it out. And you got, you know, Star Trek where it's like ball busting military. So it's like the book two that don't quite fit. But, and I don't think Rogue One is going to, but I don't think Rogue One is going to

[00:23:58] pull out like everything that is wrong with all of the rebuilt Star Trek and refitted Star Wars. I'm saying that's Star Trek. But I did enjoy, I think the star, all of the Kelvin universe stuff is just like significantly more just because it was, I think better put together films. Got good effects. It's just, it's all the villains that kind of seem to trouble everybody with it. But again, I've grown it quite as many times. I think that was the main thing. And I would have to say Star Trek. Okay.

[00:24:28] So less on here is going to be none other than Mike. Like you've seen both these trilogies and Rogue One and Solo. Where were you going to land? I got to go with Star Trek too, because it was really tough to pull that off to replace the entire cast with new, and they just, they pulled it off. They did a great job with it. You never really went like, oh, I wish Shatner was here or, you know, I thought they all did great job adapting those characters.

[00:24:58] That's true. Yeah. It could have been a disaster and they pulled it off. Yeah. Just barely, just barely Trek is going to win this point with seven to six. All right. And because Ryan and I didn't vote, because we didn't care. They still won. I mean, 2013, me like Trek, we're not in that era anymore. So weird that it's been that long. It's so mental, man.

[00:25:28] So this is going to get even trickier because I know we haven't seen both. So for those who haven't seen both, you know, don't worry. Like the whole point is judging one versus the other. So anyone who's seen both, raise your hand, both the track shows and the new Star Wars shows. Me. Okay, Matt, my. Yeah. I've seen enough to know I don't want to watch either of them. Yeah. That too. Okay. Well, that's just it. I've seen most of both. That's just it.

[00:25:54] If you don't care for either or haven't seen both, you know, just four new Star Trek shows that are Discovery, Strange New Worlds and Picard. Well, we technically haven't seen Star Trek. But anyway, I haven't seen enough of them. Okay. I have not seen any of the Star Trek stuff. Yes, I've seen both. Okay. Leslie. Okay. Well, keep your hands up. So Gil. I've seen Boba Fett. You've seen one of both. Okay. So that's why I'm asking everyone to keep their hands up so I can do the math.

[00:26:22] So Gil, Leslie, Roger. Okay. And Jason. Yeah. I've seen them all. I've seen them all. I love this. Math are hard. So, okay. That's math. Okay. So I'm going to go with Trek on this. Like, I know a lot of people did not care for Picard. I thought it was a fun side quest and really validated him a lot. But unfortunately, Star Wars is at its best in TV format.

[00:26:52] There's so much world building that makes you just realize when you hand it off to people who've grown up as fanboys, sometimes they can add just that extra layering. It's like some of them needed a little while to grow, but I really have come to appreciate Boba Fett and Obi-Wan more. So yeah, my vote's going to be for Wars. Roger, how about you? To me, it's all about strange new worlds. All right. The Boba Fett show is just ridiculously awful. I can't. It's so bad.

[00:27:21] It's one of the worst things Star Wars has done, that Boba Fett show. So disappointing. Mandalorian was decent. But for me, it's all about the strange new worlds. Okay. Leslie, where are you going to go on this? Where do you think had the best time? Well, I definitely love all of it. Okay. I really do. Right. I love strange new worlds. I even got to hang out with the cast. Oh. They're a great bunch of people.

[00:27:48] But, you know, I, and the funny thing is, I know so many people that hated Boba Fett. They thought the show was everything about it, the music and just everything about it. I'm just an oddball, I guess, because I loved it. I thought it was great. It was good. I loved it. But anyway, I'm a huge Grogu fan. I've got a lot of Grogu dolls. You know, I just, I, anyway, I, I got to go with Star Wars.

[00:28:15] I, I loved all the shows that Star Wars have done on television. I thought they are so good. All of them. Except for, except for Ahsoka. All right. Fair enough. I did not like that series. I did not think it was good. I didn't like that one. Yeah. Season two will determine whether it grows any legs, but we'll see. All right. So, Matt, I think you said you'd seen both. Yes. All right. So. Yeah, it's tough. These are, I love them both.

[00:28:42] I think they both had, they also have both had things that were really tough to, that were, you know, I think not, I would say not, you know, fairly. Explained. Representing. Part of. But, you know, and they're like, I still think that they really missed out on a chance for a, the Amanda Grogu, like partner, you know, like buddy cop kind of show that they could have gone forever. BJ LeBair. No. Oh my God. Oh my God. Yeah. Great turn.

[00:29:12] Star Wars. How about that? Yeah. But God, I really struggled with which one I'd say I'd like more. I guess I'm going to have to, I'm going to have to lean Star Wars on this one. All right. Something about Mondo's cinematography and world building. All right. So Gil, you've only seen Mondo and you've seen most of the other track shows, but you're mixed on both. Which one? I would have to give it to Star Wars in this case because they garnered more attention

[00:29:37] and Star Trek kind of took some missteps with Discovery and Picard, especially the first two seasons of Picard, I think were missteps. All right. So yeah, I have to go with Star Wars. All righty. Oreo. Hmm. What the hell are we going to do with this? This is so much. Torch it. Okay. Well, what's that option? I know. Like I've seen probably 70% of it. Love Trek.

[00:30:06] I always loved Trek, but definitely with world, like both have great world building, but they do stop at certain points of world building. Fair enough. And then explore more of that in the books and shit. But anyway, I put Star Wars. Okay. Perfect. Even though I didn't like Mando that much. Oh, man. The balls of this guy. I love it. Fuck Gru and fuck Luke. Oh, man.

[00:30:37] Sith Lord has taken him over. I mean, you can type that into AI GPT stuff and probably get all sorts of photos and video of that. Yeah, for true. Soto. Yeah, I've seen both as well, too. And man, I have to agree that, you know, while Discovery does have his missteps, so does Picard, Strangely Worlds is blowing it out of the park at this point. And I did see the first two episodes of Academy as well, too. They're pretty good so far. But you got to kind of let that simmer as a little bit, too. But with Star Wars, I mean, Mando, I really like that one.

[00:31:07] Book of both of it. Yeah, you're right. And or I got to give to Star Wars specifically because of Andor and Mando. Both of those were really, really good. I think, you know, with the shows as well, too, if there are many movies like that, hands down, Star Wars takes it. Trek just needs to get back to where it needed to be, where it was like single episodes of what are we doing this week? And that's it.

[00:31:33] It doesn't need this progression of a single episode, you know, movie for a 10 hour long movie. It needs to be 40, 45 minutes and done. That's it. That's that was the strength of Star Trek at its height was here's a few pages out of the book. Yeah. Right. Here's a chapter. And then, oh, previously on maybe this happened, but it wasn't as serialized. Well, I love my favorite. One of my favorite Star Treks was Deep Space Nine. And they have a serialized arc. Yeah, that's for sure.

[00:32:02] So yeah, I'm going with Wars. OK, perfect. And Travis, you have seen both or nay? No, I've really only seen the Star Wars stuff recently, unfortunately. Well, it doesn't matter, guys, because despite Roger, you did a great job repping track. Unfortunately, Wars is going to nuke the TV shows the fuck out of the water. We'll return after these messages. All right, folks, Haltech here. We've got a 90-minute weekly Shaq stop.

[00:32:31] It's growing all over the world. Find it at 2 p.m. and 10 p.m. Eastern Time on Mondays. Then 3 p.m. on Wednesdays. Then 7 p.m. on Thursdays. You can catch it on many more radio stations. 99.9 KERV. 1 p.m. Central Time. 2 p.m. Eastern on Mondays. Then catch the Encore on Thursdays at 5 p.m. Central Time, 6 p.m. Eastern.

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[00:33:25] 12 p.m. Eastern Time on MXTR FM and 10 p.m. Eastern Time, 9 p.m. Central, 1077 K-Twins. Find everything on Halshack.com. Halshack. If you like small-town mystery, crazy news, and wild history, then the Florida Men on Florida Man podcast is for you.

[00:33:50] Each week, Josh Mills and Wayne McCarty bring you the absolute best Florida has to offer. So if you're looking for a show that's safe for the family but funny enough to help you escape everyday life, then listen to the Florida Men on Florida Man podcast. That's Florida Men, plural, on Florida Man podcast. Do you ever find yourself thinking about who would win in a fight between Goku and Superman? Hi, I'm James Gavsey, and on the Who Would Win show, me and my co-host Ray ignore anything important happening in the outside world

[00:34:19] and debate fictional battles between characters from comics, movies, and video games. We got a new show every week, and almost always am I the winner. Yeah, not true, Ray. In the past, we've discussed such matches as Captain America vs. Darth Vader, Solid Snake vs. the Iron Giant, classic matchups like Robocop vs. Terminator, and even the Muppets vs. Sesame Street. That one was crazy. So if you're a fan of geek culture and love a spirited debate, check out the Who Would Win show wherever you get your podcasts,

[00:34:49] or check us out at whowouldwinshow.com. Now we're on to the cartoons! There's some good, there's some bad, man. We got the animated series of Track, which is basically seasons 4 and 5 of the original show in animated form. We got Lower Decks and Prodigy, and the amusing YouTube series Very Short Tracks, which basically takes the animated series and makes fun of every track era. Versus Ewoks, Droids, both Clone Wars shows,

[00:35:19] Rebels, Bad Batch, and the Disney anthology shows in Flash animations. We got a cluster here. It's a short cluster, though. You'd think Trek would have put out more cartoons, but I lost. Alright, so I'll make this easy. Who's with Trek in any capacity? No. Alright. I need your hands to stay up. Okay, so Roger, Matt, Jason, Mike. Okay. This whole thing, that grid keeps shuffling back and forth. Okay.

[00:35:49] Tom, Chase, Matt, Litwin, Roger, Mike. Okay. Yeah, Tom. So I think it looks like Trek is across the board. Anyone who doesn't care for either or cares for Wars? I would only pick Star Wars because of the robot chicken bits that are animated. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, but there was Star Trek robot chicken stuff.

[00:36:14] The 70s era Star Trek animation had the writers from the original series in it. Yep. Right. And I dug that Hanna-Barbera style animation. Grew up with those, right? Like, I remember watching those Star Trek the animated series. I loved it. But her Jetty Tartakovsky Clone Wars series. That was a great one, too. That was good. I have that. Because of that, I have to give it to Star Wars alone. That was so good. And Tartakovsky is fantastic.

[00:36:44] When Obi-Wan and Darth Maul finally meet in Rebels, like, that's a fucking great moment. Oh, yeah. I'm not even taking Clone Wars and Rebels into account. I'm just that first Clone Wars series that were, like, ten minutes long. You got Samurai Jack in Star Wars form. Yeah, exactly. No, he figured out how to do, like, the storytelling in that is so good. And it's better as a movie, honestly, because somebody uploaded it in 2K to their YouTube and then it got taken down.

[00:37:13] I downloaded it before it got taken down. You got Mace Windu punching the hell out of droids with just his bare hands. Yes. I need you to send me that, because I would love to watch that. It was great to see, like, the other Jedi, like, Saistin and, you know, Kit Fisto. Hell of a name. Yeah. Ki Di Mundi, like, you know, fighting. And the thing is, what Gedi Taranowski did was he basically was building it up for, you know,

[00:37:43] because remember, the last episode leads into Revenge of the Sith. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know? Right. And I think that's where, you know, that Star Trek animation, the one that came out in the 70s from Filmation. Yeah. Because they couldn't get the theme from Alexander Kersh, because I think either it was copyrighted or, like, Roddenberry, what I'm doing or anything like that. Yes. The thing that I... I'm going to say Star Wars on the animated, though. All righty.

[00:38:13] No, it's fine. They fell into that trap of, and I hate to say this, that Filmation does really use the same piece of animation over and over again. Oh, yeah. Like, if somebody's running or something like that, they did it with B-Man. They did it with, you know, all the other cartoons. That's why I was emphasizing the writing on that show. Yeah. The writing was great. And you got to realize, Walter Koenig actually wrote, I think, two or three episodes. And Scotty, actor, voiced a bunch of other aliens. So, hurry up.

[00:38:41] If you had asked me this question in the late 90s, Star Trek, hands down, because of that 70s series. That was so good, and it was so formative for me. I remember watching it, but then those Clone Wars ones came out, and it was just like, all right, this is... There's a book for it, Oral? Yeah, there's a book for the Star Trek animated series. I covered it a few years ago. Oh.

[00:39:08] And I don't know how anybody else feels about it, but I loved Lower Decks, too, because it was a love letter to fans. Oh, that is the one I need to say. It was silly, too. A lot of it is silly. Yeah. But it was so much fun. I wish I could say the same. Lower Decks, just... The animation, they just got so lazy on after a while, and I just didn't... It just felt like a bunch of hipsters getting together, just saying, see what we did there, and I'm like, see, Trek doesn't need internet humor to be funny. Kind of like our podcast.

[00:39:37] We're all hipsters. Oh, you guys are cool. I'm an old fart, so... Prodigy is... I don't have enough hair to be a hipster. Prodigy is okay. It's okay. Buy a wig. I got enough for you, don't worry. But Prodigy is okay, but my problem is, it's taking that Star Wars class, Clone Wars animation and trying to be Star Wars again. I'm like, what's with all the space pirates? And why do we... Why can't we have Janeway herself instead of a hologram interacting with everybody? It's kind of like... Well, she does, eventually.

[00:40:07] Oh, there we go. Yeah. I haven't seen Prodigy, but I get where you're coming from with that. I really do. Well, and I don't know any of their... Or the Lower Decks guys' names. And it's been over two seasons. So, I can't say that's good writing if I don't know at least five people's names. And let me say something about the Star Wars stuff out now, animation-wise. Bad Batch, amazing. Okay? Rebels, amazing. And whoever brought...

[00:40:35] Who brought up the thing with Darth Maul and Obi-Wan? I did! Yeah, Ryan is the best. The way they did that... You thought... We were all thinking when we saw that there's going to be a big, big duel. And they just do it like the samurai movie that I saw a long time ago. Where it was called... Was it the Blood Red Bat or something like that? Where the guy runs and he... The front of blood, I think. Yeah. Was it? Something like that. It might be front of blood. Yeah.

[00:41:03] The guy who's the samurai training the female samurai. Basically, the guy just runs at him. And he just takes his sword and just goes... And just takes the guy down in half. That's what made it... It was exciting, but it was minimalist. Well, it's R5. That's what I liked about it. I think it's R4 is the one droid. Not R4. R5, I think, is the one cool droid. The yellow droid. Chopper. Chopper. Yeah, Chopper. Hit. Get to the Chopper. Chopper was psychopathic, though.

[00:41:33] I will say this, though. Resistance is massively underrated. Yeah. People shit on that so hard. I hated that. People shit on that show so badly. And the last season of The Clone Wars, where you do have that thing going back and forth where you feel Anakin's fall to the dark side through Ahsoka, through Maul, of all people.

[00:42:01] And then, you know, to have Captain Rex save her while the other clone troopers just basically perish. It was either him or Rex from Toy Story saving him. Yeah. I mean, the thing they do... Put out! The thing they do... And you guys realize something. We were talking about The Mandalorian before. You know who the unsung hero of The Mandalorian is? R5-D4. R5-D4. Yeah. R5-D4. He is the unsung hero. Yeah. All right. So, Leslie or Charlie, do you have any closing thoughts?

[00:42:31] Oh, well, for me, definitely Star Wars. Oh, man. I enjoyed those more than the Star Trek, even though I really do... I do like Prodigy. I think it is really... I think it's really good. But... Fair enough. Yeah. You know. I get it. It's Star Wars. Oh, she's a good hit series. I have not seen any of the Star Trek animated stuff, so I have to refrain. Trek is barely getting the win on this, but that's okay. I voted. I voted. I voted. Yeah. All right.

[00:43:01] So, now we're to the most divisive one of this whole thing. We are to the infamous TV specials. Oh, God, no. If you do not like either, you can abstain. If you want to find any of these fun, I will give a vote for Section 31, because I like that Fifth Element world they built. Is there shit in it I do not like? Absolutely. There's some stuff that does not need to be in there. That's Star Wars Special Edition bad.

[00:43:24] But I dug how we got to know about how this gal became a warlord, and I just thought her crew was pretty pimp. We're comparing Section 31 and... The Star Wars Holiday Special. Star Wars Holiday Special. I don't think anyone in their right mind likes the Holiday Special. I mean... Listen, you officially got Boba Fett. Besides that parade the year or two before, you officially get Boba Fett in the Holiday Special. Yeah.

[00:43:48] Yeah, but then you also have 10 minutes of Grandpa Wookiee knocking off the internet. Oh, we're facing it. Yes, you do. I re-balanced the Wookiee talk. I re-watched the Holiday Special this past Christmas. I've said that the best way to watch the Holiday Special is to watch the riff tracks of it. We'll see. Exactly. That's the only way I've seen it. And the thing with it, like, I remember watching it for the first time, and my thought was like,

[00:44:14] Chewie works because you get the context clues from everybody around him. Han kills a guy. You don't need to know what he's saying. But when you have 15 minutes of just three Wookiees growling at each other with no one else in the room and no subtitles, like, what the hell are we doing? It's like a Mr. Kurosawa movie. I might be the only one here who watched it live. So I remember as a kid. There you go. I remember watching it. I remember being broken.

[00:44:44] But it's just a matter of does anyone like either of these? Oh, no. It's... That's all we're going on. Leslie, you like it all. Do you like even this? Well, I mean, if we're supposed to pick bad over worse or whatever, both were just so horrible. But the better of the two, I'm going to go with Star Trek. Because that Star Wars holiday special was just... If you don't like either, you don't have to vote for either of them.

[00:45:10] I thought both were terrible, but I would rather watch the Star Trek one than that holiday special. And I saw it live, and believe it or not, at that time, because I'm a kid, I was such a huge Star Wars fan that, oh my gosh, I was glued to the television. I thought it was great. You know, anything you could get your hands on that was Star Wars. You were just like dying for it. It was a forbidden fruit back then. It's like anything. Yeah, I'll take anything. Give me anything. It comes down to Michelle Yeoh versus Bea Arthur.

[00:45:42] That's not fair. That is Sophie's choice. I have to abstain. I can't vote for one or the other because I love both. Oh, you love both? I love both Michelle Yeoh and Bea Arthur. Not the... No, no, see. No, no. It's whatever you can take. Okay, so Oreo, do you like any of these? Yeah. Yeah. Well, for one... He loves his hot takes.

[00:46:11] He has surprised us time and again. I always surprise people. Like, oh shit, he likes that? I hate it. Honestly, next time we have a debate like this, and it's for character-specific playing characters, we can do that. Then we can have civil debates. But for these two, be nuts. All right, so... I've never seen either one of them. Okay, well, so you can't vote anyway. You're missing out.

[00:46:40] All right, so because... It's so bad, but you almost have to respect the fault it takes for them to make this and then present it to George Lucas and then air it. Whoa, whoa. That takes... You have this on Blu-ray? You have this on Blu-ray? A Blu-ray version with all kinds of special features. Does George Lucas know about that Blu-ray? Does it come with all the commercials that were in the... I thought this Blu-ray was going to be the most insane thing I ever saw. Captain America!

[00:47:10] You beat me! Oh yeah, that's the director's cut. Is that the one from Yippie Kaya? That's the 1990 one. From Yippie Kaya Mother Video. Right, right, but there's the director's cut that just came out. The Captain America movie where twice he pretends to throw up to steal a car. Oh yeah, yeah. I love it. I mean, I have that. I want to get that recut. Okay, so Leslie and I gave Section 31 and decent pass. No, I'd go with Section 31 too. Yeah, I would too. All right, so Litwin is going to vote for that and Gil is going to vote for that surprisingly. Okay.

[00:47:41] Jason is a Section 31 as well. Jason is voting for it too. Okay, so... Yeah. See, man. So five people on the planet like Section 31. I love it. I can also vote for Section 31. I can also vote for Section 31. I can also vote for Section 31. Well, like I said, if you don't like either, you don't have to vote. I'll also vote for Section 31. All right, so Soto is voting. Okay, perfect. Just to see Michelle Yell just ham it up as well too. I mean, if she just chews that scenery. I can watch her do anything.

[00:48:10] Although Star Wars quality special might work if you're stoned. No, it won't. I can promise you that. As a former Delta 8 user, it still sucks. Donkey balls. So now we're to the easier part. Nope. Oh, yes, we are, man. Trust me. Who has better video games? There's only one answer. Star Wars. Hands down. Is there any opposition with Star Trek?

[00:48:35] No, I will say that there was a Star Trek game early from like 1972 that was kind of like a battleship. But it was like a text-based role-playing game, like a text-based adventure. And it had a battleship hut. And I only just found out about this the other day. And it's pretty incredible for how early it is. So it's kind of awesome. The Star Trek arcade game, the stand-up one from the early 80s. Oh, yeah. It was fun as hell if you could find it.

[00:49:06] The Vector graphics one? Yeah. There's a couple good Star Trek games. Star Trek Legacy is my favorite. Yeah, you got to play as all your favorite captains. The Vector Star Wars game. And then the Dark Forces. Oh, Jesus. My friend had that. Yeah, those are better. There was an RPG as well. What was it called? Right. Has anyone played the TTRPGs of Trek or Wars? Negative.

[00:49:34] I've dabbled a little bit with the Star Wars one. I haven't done the Star Trek one, though. I didn't know the chance. All right. Tom, I know you like your Star Wars games. You were going to say something. I was going to say, I was going to put in a plug for a PS2 game that absolutely left for Star Trek. It was called Shattered Universe, I think it was. Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. That was amazing. But nothing beats Battlefront. Nothing. I agree. Even Battlefront 2. My God.

[00:50:04] I mean, you got to play. Battlefront 2 was good, too. It was so much fun just taking the hills. It's like, yeah, this is now owned by Imperials. Now this is owned by the Troid Army. So, yeah, that's pretty much we swept the leg there on video games. How about how do we fill on the comics? I'd go with Star Trek, especially if Peter David was writing. Right? It's so hard, though. I mean, there's good Trek comics and there's good movies. The new Marvel Star Wars stuff, the early stuff, the Jason Aaron and the Kieran Gillen

[00:50:34] stuff, the Dark Theta series is fantastic. I bet. Yeah, it's really good. The Star Trek stuff was great if they did like a graphic novel or something like that. But Star Wars and that includes the Marvel era, the Dark Horse era, and now the retelling of all these single shots that they're doing sometimes. I like it. I like how they've retconned a lot of stuff like Luke's yellow lightsaber, how he got that. That I like.

[00:51:04] You know, finally, it's a lot of it is now explanations that we want. And they've gone back and they've basically just, you know, said, OK, we're going to give you what you need. Star Trek. I don't know. I mean, the one I loved was Planet of the Apes meets Star Trek. Right. That counts. That was a direct. Yeah. Yeah. And much like the video games, especially those early PC games, I dug how. Trust me, I have more fun reading comic books of Trek.

[00:51:33] But unfortunately, Wars was kind of. The main one in the sand that drew that line, just showing you how they not only adapted some of the books, you know, but, you know, then you get Dark Empire alone that that pretty much just is the nail in the coffin on how do you much like the other Dark Horse licenses for Alien, Predator and Terminator is like you are making these your own in comic book form. And so that's why just by just slightly, just a bit, I got to give awards credit.

[00:52:03] There's so much more Star Wars comics than there is Star Trek. And I love the 80s DC stuff that they did for Star Trek. But yeah, there's just so much more Star Wars. That's good. I mean, don't get me wrong. Malibu was brilliant before it got taken over by DC having the whole let's crossover with, you know, Marvel, who's like, if you want the we're going to do a crossover with DS9 and next gen guys, if you want to read the fall, you know, the two parter of that issue, you got to buy, you know, one from one of our rivals.

[00:52:33] And yeah, and if you want to read those comics now, you can go to get comics.org and just type in the title and find it and download it for a PDF. You've got to see Oreo stash. All right. So where are you going to land with that vote for you? I'm tied on that. No, get tied. You cannot tie. I like both of them. Trek has great shit. Wars is amazing shit, too.

[00:53:02] I really can't decide. All right. So I'll tell you what, when we get these other votes, you will break the tie. How about that? All right. Oh, great. All right. So, Tom, where are you going to land? I'm going to land with Trek because my first experience with the Star Trek comic books was the Gold Key era. Oh, God. Yeah. Going way back. Good stuff. Those are fun, too. And they were just fantastic. And they had painted covers. And like, Star Wars did okay. And then they didn't.

[00:53:31] So for that alone, I'm going with Trek. I love it. All right. So Soto, not Solo. I'm going to say Trek just specifically because I remember the X-Men Star Trek crossover. Yes. And Nurse Chappell coming in and saying, Dr. McCoy and both Beast and Bones looking at me like, what? The portographic sounding title Second Contact. And maybe even crossover with Green Lantern and Planet of the Apes. Green Lantern was good.

[00:54:02] I like that. Somebody had to. But yeah, Trek is all the way from me. All right. Ryan, where do you land on Comics Writer if you've read any of them? I have. What is that supposed to name? I don't know. Oh, wow. If you've seen it or not. Because I'm getting a lot of never seen. Okay. Awesome. What do you think? My mom used to work for a company that colored comic books. I got like 10,000 of them in my room. That's right. You did tell us about that on your show. No, I just, I'm going to go Star Wars because simply, and it's just to, you know,

[00:54:32] to touch on the video games and the books and the novels. I think people who wrote Star Wars Extended Universes, there's so much more to go on. And I think that they, not all the time, obviously some of them suck. They're fucking terrible. But I think a lot of the Extended Universe of Star Wars is just way more creative. Yeah. Yeah. What do they do with Star Trek? Perfect. I love it. And I like how you guys don't hold back. Like this, we are trying to validate you all here.

[00:55:02] So this is awesome. So, Roger, what do you think? I don't know. It's almost a flip them. I mean, they both have really good books on both sides. Yeah. I'd like to be a bar with Peter David over DC early stuff. No one trick ponies here. We got some actual. No, it's a tough one. But I think in terms of quality and quantity, you might have to go with Star Wars. It's just they have too many. Charlie the Unicorn, what do you think? I'm going with Star Wars.

[00:55:29] There's enough Darth Vader stuff that's pretty good that I'm picking Star Wars over Star Trek. It's more detailed than the prequels. Hey! Leslie, what do you think? Well, I'm actually going to have to abstain because I'm not at all familiar with that part of the fandom. Woo! Charlie! Dark Horse, your Jedi mind tricks did not work on. No. All right. I love it. Okay. Anyone who I left out? Mike?

[00:55:57] I'm passing on that because I haven't done anything. But as far as Jason is the absolute law when it comes to anything related. He's the law. He's kept dread. Yeah. Like a three-story house that's just full of comics. It's not. No, my office is. You can't see on this side, but there's just. He knows it all. He knows everything. But my Star Wars stuff's in the other room. So. Perfect. My Star Trek, actually. Both of them are in the other room. I'm surprised you were able to pick one.

[00:56:27] I have 10,000 comics and I have the entire Marvel run of Star Trek or Star Wars. Nice. But that's about it. But you went with Trek? Like the original Star Wars? I went with Trek because I have a lot of Trek books too. Right. But you have the original Star Wars run, like the Michael Chaik and stuff? Yep. Nice. I'm jealous. Well, you can come hang out with us in Des Moines and we'll see if you can give him an offer he can't refuse. There's so much. I'm on the other side of the continent in a different country.

[00:56:57] Yeah, that's not happening. I wish we could leave you here. It's not the off season yet. So, when were you going to land? Got to abstain. I haven't seen enough of it. Okay. It's mapping time. Arithmetic. That's why I was going for the other ones. It's like, let's get done with the easy ones. I'm arithmetic. Alright, so we got free track votes to the Wars votes and I don't know from Orioles.

[00:57:26] And the partridge in a pear tree. So, Wars is going to take it to the fucking bank. Okay, so then we got the 70s to 90s era books. Star Wars easily. Do you think it's pretty, I think everyone's going to go with Wars on this one. If there's any dissenters, let us know. Matt Gill. 70s and 90s, you said? Yes. And novels? Yes. Books. Yeah. I've only read a handful.

[00:57:54] I'm expecting Roger to have more props. I'm very impressed by Roger's props. I have a whole slew of novels over there. Oh, man. Star Trek novels. Well, at least it wasn't Geordi telling us to, you know, open a book. It's reading Rainbow. All I got to say is Star Trek New Frontier with Peter David as the writer on those books. Yeah. I have read more Star Trek than I have Star Wars novels. The opposite. You know, the Peter David stuff. Who I've interviewed. I did a DVD interview with him and Mike Barr. Big two other Star Trek guys.

[00:58:24] Yeah, Star Trek guys. Big comic guys. I love it. So, okay, so Soto, Gil, Roger, and Jason are for Trek. And Wars is still going to take it. But that's okay. Hey, it was a good fight. I will say, and it may be a little bit of fighting words, but only one universe doesn't canonize some of those books. Just saying. No, that's a good point. Shatner decided with his alternate universe, hey, I'm just going to bring Captain Kirk back and play all the roles.

[00:58:53] Everyone, if you can, listen to the audiobook. It's so much better than actually reading. I remember when he got on Conan, he says, well, I died in the last Star Trek. And I was like, well, you know what? I'm not going to die. Yeah, yeah. It's a total. Such a Shatner quote. It is. I love that whole, I reject your reality and substitute my own and I'm legally doing it. I didn't like how he died in the Generations movie myself. Oh, no. I enjoyed that movie. I agree with you, Gil. I agree.

[00:59:22] But I really liked that movie. No, I get it. It's one of those that this is the only compromise we get is in book form is like he's kind of still alive. So now we're on to theme park attractions. I think most of us have seen Wars. So I think that's going to take the kick. Yeah, pretty much. Just start having any experience with those. So just start. That's the way that they exist. But I don't know how many Trek actually has. Yeah. There was one at Universal. Right. There was some Vegas thing, too. Vegas. Yeah.

[00:59:51] It was the Vegas experience and shut down around 07 ish, maybe 04. But if you look at videos of it, it was pretty cool. You had a hologram. Yeah, I went to that. I went to that. And it was it was absolutely amazing. It was incredible. It was great. It was a holographic doctor shot. It was kind of like the Men in Black ride at Universal is like the recorded stuff. And they're telling everybody, get ready. And then all these actors dressed up as Borg or other aliens come in and try to kill you. And you got to follow the trick.

[01:00:22] Yeah, you can find some YouTube on it. But unfortunately, Star Tours is just so awesome. And believe it or not, that's a then unknown Allison Janney doing the voice. True story. CJ on the West Wing is telling us how to get the hell out of Dodge and get on the damn pod with the droid. So, Leslie, you like both. Which do you land on? Oh, well, it's unfortunate. I mean, in a way, this is it isn't a very fair category just because there's so much. I've gone to the Star Wars universe place, you know, and it's unbelievable.

[01:00:51] Those rides are incredible. I mean, it's a simple thing. It's like you're filming an episode is like we're on the count of three. We're going to make the stage flip. And I got to go with Star Wars. All right. Yeah. See, it's freaking easy to quote Jack Black. So now we're to the fan films. There's a lot of hysterical Star Wars fan films, everything from Pink Five to, you know, the rap video. Yeah. And Werewolf and George Lucas and Love.

[01:01:19] And then Hardware Wars. Hardware Wars. I knew you were going to bring that up. You know, there's more than just that one, James. Oh, I know. I know. And then there's some wars. But Hardware Wars was like the first. Yes, it was. Yeah. But it wasn't the last. Oh, Ernie Vestelius. Yes. And with Star Trek, we got some fucking awesome fan films where the actual actors are coming back, you know. And CBS is suing them, too. I know. That's how good they are.

[01:01:48] The one I liked was the one that the Elvis impersonator was doing, the new version of Star Trek, where they wrote in like, Scotty got the mustache and everything like that. Yeah. Yeah. Star Trek continues. And then we got a prelude to Axanar, which brought back some of the Vulcan guys. And Tony Todd was being like the first admiral of Starfleet. It's fucking awesome. So this is so hard. I think I'm going to be the only guy backing up the Star Trek fan films. Is everyone else? Oh, that would be me, too. Okay. So also be.

[01:02:18] Okay. So Jason Gill and I are on the track track. Oh, and Matt. Oh, and Tom, man. Okay. Yep. Jeez. You know, Troopers was good, but. Also, I count a lot of like the budding VFX artists who just publish their stuff on YouTube, like redoing, you know, the Defiant going against the Cardassians or stuff like that as those fan films as well, too, because those are amazing look. And it's just like.

[01:02:47] Oh, I didn't think about that. That's a good. That's a good point. And it's movie level quality. And you're like, but they did this with their own hard earned cash. Their own hard drives, their own processors, everything. And I'm not trying to get over political here. I hate how now the Star Trek fan films and the trackies are now in cahoots with each other. It's like, guys, you're breathing and eating, you know, in the same airwaves. Good God. Just get along. And in a way, it gives you more.

[01:03:16] We can say there's more than just six Star Trek shows. There's seven others, you know, web series and fan films. Gods and Men is in my top 10 Star Trek films. And that's basically a Generations and TOS sequel. Just a lot of fun. Cool send out for Tuvok and Chekhov. All right. But Wars is everyone else pretty much voted Wars except the five of us. So, yeah. I'd go with track. I'm going with track. Oh, really? Man. The tables have turned. Star Trek continues, you know.

[01:03:46] Oh, of the fan stuff, I vote track. Okay. You got to go with track. Man. I love it. Man. Especially because I've done a lot of fan films. Same. I'll show you. I'm just saying, I don't remember seeing a short film where Batman fought Vader. So, no. Oh, yeah. I saw that. That was pretty awesome. Did he use a super chop on him and it blocked a lightsaber or what? What did he do?

[01:04:13] He threw an orphan in front of him. Vader captured Superman and is keeping him in somewhere in the Death Star with like kryptonite gas to keep him not powerful. At first, I thought you said it was Kirk versus Vader because in that case, Kirk would proceed to have sex with him. And went. I love it. It's not green, though. Yeah.

[01:04:41] Also, doesn't Galaxy Quest count as a Star Wars fan film? Oh, totally. And if we're going to get that technical for us as a Star Trek fan. Foundation and Battlestar Galactica. Yeah, those are track fan films. Throw it all in. Orville's a fan film. Yeah. All right. Perfect. So, track is going to win. All right. Love it. And now we're to the newer books. From the 2000s and onward. Because I just, everyone was like, well, they all vary over time. Like, yeah, that's why I divided it for you.

[01:05:10] Because once Disney takes it. Yeah, Star Wars easily. Because just for the Bong War itself. That was fucking brutal. Okay. I'm going to go with track on this one. The earlier Wars books are great. But these newer ones. I've actually been fortunate enough to interview tie-in author James Swallows. And I think he said it best. They have now hired people who actually like these properties. Instead of just getting people who say yes to every tie-in. So, I really like the newer track books. Yeah. Now, obviously. What are some of the newer ones? Because I honestly don't know.

[01:05:40] What are some of the newer ones? There's some newer Enterprise ones. There's also three different trilogies for TOS. Which are amazing. And get into the whole Vulcan folklore. And they're just exciting. Like, you feel like. There's the one that actor who played Gal Ducat wrote. Which is this. Oh, yeah. I have them on my screen. Stitch and Time. That was good. I got that. The new Strange New Worlds ones are also good. Like, you feel like you're actually running across the plains. With Pike and company.

[01:06:09] They're very good at vivid descriptions. Every other book can just feel just self-indulgent. Or just like they were struggling to get to the word count and page count. But, yeah. I like new track books. So, if I'm the only trackie on the books. On the newer books. Oh, Gil. Again. Okay. But, with that. I have to abstain. I haven't read any of them. Okay. No. It's fine. Okay. You should get the audiobooks then. You'll really enjoy them. Same. I loved them. Yeah.

[01:06:38] An audiobook is the way to go. I can't. I can only read comic books by hand versus a physical book. I need an audio because I need it narrated so I can fill the picture out in my head better. How about with sock puppets? I love audiobooks. Okay. So, was anyone? Well, there was that episode of Angel where they did all puppets. And didn't Strange New Worlds do a puppet episode? Yes, they did. Well, they got one upcoming. Yes. One upcoming next season. But, kind of like Tom's earlier point.

[01:07:04] There were just some newer Star Wars books post-Marvel Takeover that were just kind of like, yeah, you guys are just cashing in on this. So, does anyone like any of the newer Star Wars books? Or is it just Gil and I? Okay. Well, so, just by two points, Gil and I are going to poison the well. Awesome. Now to the easier thing. Easier. And I will make this easy for you all. Unless said otherwise, is Star Wars better with the battles? I hate to say this, but I think so.

[01:07:33] I think DS9 had some pretty good space battles, but I think Star Wars still wins it. I'm the only trackie on this one because I love the con battles and I love just some of the sabotage stuff that DS9 and Voyager did. But, well, I hope battles in the prequels are unbelievable. Those are great too, though. It's kind of like how early Star Trek beat out Star Wars because of volume. Star Wars beats out Star Trek because it's just volume of like 100%. The good battles that they have.

[01:08:03] Plus the music and the choreography and editing. You've got Yavin, Hoth, and Endor. I mean, those three alone. Yeah. John Williams and they are doing the music for it. I know. Yeah. But let's say this, though. Does the battle of the Mitarra Nebula in Star Trek 2 rank as one of your greats? Not even. Let's take that out of context for sponsoring. One of the best battles movies, battles in a movie of all time. But how about the fact that Spock blew up God?

[01:08:32] Well, hey. I'd say that was more like a strategy. That was a strategy. But yeah. It reminded me. It's got a good point. Yeah. It reminded me of a World War II movie where, you know, like think the Bismarck. You know, it reminded me of that. You know, they're hunting. Well, that's exactly what they intended. I mean, Wrath of Khan and, you know, wars, like you say, is responsible for everything good in film. But yes, Wrath of Khan starts the whole submarines in space style and is like, oh, man.

[01:09:02] It's the flip side of what I said earlier where it was like Empire was the best single moment of the early stuff. But Star Trek went out. That with Wrath of Khan might be the best single moment. And if we're going with TV, I mean, how about the entirety of the best of both worlds two-parter? I mean, that alone, like that feels. Oh, no. Let's go one back more. The one with them trying to hunt the Romulans down.

[01:09:31] Yeah, that was a submarine type battle, too. Yeah, it was good. Well, what do you think of the Doomsday Machine? Like that is exciting. Literally, Kirk is on a tie, you know. Is that? But then also you got to throw out like the whole thing with the Death Star in the Battle of the Heaven. So exactly. Yeah, it's hard. It's just classic face battle. The Maverick stole it. Yeah. Yeah, right? Well, and I mean, Lucas lifted it from the World War II movies. So everybody stole from something.

[01:09:59] Well, which is why none of the physics makes sense in Star Wars. Yeah, I agree. Oh, sure. None of the physics makes sense. But it's because it's what's going to look good in a movie. Also, the fact that like. Are we going with wars on the battles? Yeah. I'm with Trek. Yeah. Of course. Yeah, I was thinking Chaotix. That's why I voted Star Wars. But you guys brought up all these other ones. And I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm going with Trek now.

[01:10:22] So Trek is more battleship based, whereas wars is about let's get all into it. Spectacle. It's more behind the scenes. Wars is more visceral. Yeah. Wars puts you in the battle. Star Wars is just, oh, a lot going on. It's compact. I think Star Trek is more tactical. Yeah. Yeah. Right. I'm going to go with Star Trek. Okay. One of my favorite battle scenes, though, in all of Star Wars is in Return of the Jedi

[01:10:51] when it's Luke and the Death Star, then it's Lando in space, and then it's Han on, you know, the planet. Like, it's just, and they just keep cutting back and forth. And introduce the free story, you know, free parts of one battle. Yeah. Yep. All right. So now we're going to technology. Are we going to give it to Trek? I'm going to give it to Trek. Any dissenting votes? Seems like Trek. Star Trek. All right. Star Wars is that one. I got static. All right. Or stagnant. So do you prefer lightsabers?

[01:11:21] Star Trek. All right. Star Trek. That's why I'm making this easy for us. We're going to go through. Transporters, replicators, holodeck. All right. Perfect. And we all know, like, the Enterprise could destroy a Super Star Destroyer really easily. Absolutely. But that's the firepower. Can it survive going into another universe, though? Mm-hmm. Yes. All right. So now we're to fight scenes. I'm giving this to Star Wars because I love me some flipping around in the air like a kung fu movie.

[01:11:51] Despite loving how Spock just, you know, knocks people out with his, you know, ball and pitch. The double-fisted axe handle. I know. I love me some Kirk. But it's great. But you ain't got nothing. And you can tell it's the double half the time, you know. Oh, look, I got four words for you. Way to spoil the fun, James. I got four words, though. Duel of the fates. Yes. Yes. Mic drop. Let's go. Definitely Star Wars. There's no comparison. All right. Perfect. Now we're going to narrative creative vision.

[01:12:20] Are we going to give extra points to Trek? Trek. Are we giving that much talent? Or do we have some wars? Okay. Trek. Easily. Awesome. I'm going to go Trek here. Awesome. I'm going to have a vote for fight scenes in Trek, too. Okay. Style. I'm going to go with Trek on that. Better costume designs and ships. Star Wars. Okay. Star Wars. Star Wars. And Star Trek Beyond was the best because it was the 50th anniversary for Trek, so they

[01:12:47] had 50 different aliens they created for that film. Okay. So Ryan and James. Okay. Perfect. I'm the same for Star Wars because all college girls dress like Han Solo. Yeah. I'm going to go with Star Wars. I'm going to go with Star Wars on that one. Okay. Han Solo's wearing the same stuff. 30 years later. The same exact outfit. If you looked like Han Solo, would you change? Yeah. Because I wouldn't. If I looked like Han Solo, I'd wear the same thing every day.

[01:13:17] Instead of saying, you know, best style, you need to say best style. Oh. Because that kind of emphasizes all of it. So it's not like, hey, best style. Who is the best style? Oh, my. Oh, my. Well, but there again, though, it's unfair because you got Billy Dee Williams and Star Wars. I know. We got George Takai or Billy Dee. It's hard to pick. So, Matt. Oh, damn it. I forgot about George. So, Soto, you're going with Trek? Of course. Okay. Well, so despite the four of us dissenting, there were five who won out with Wars.

[01:13:47] I'm tied. Then that doesn't work. All right. So. Anyway, Wars wins. Hey, so let's go to epic music. Are we all going just with Wars on this? Making it easier? Yeah. It's got the more. All right. Perfect. Soto's shaking his head. Soto. Okay. Awesome. He hates John Williams, obviously. No. I don't hate John Williams. I just think Enterprising Young Men is a very good song.

[01:14:13] Especially at the beginning of that new track with Enterprising Young Men is just a great soundtrack that has just a little bit of the old soundtrack. I love James Horner, but unfortunately, the casino Star Wars lounge theme is going to be our wake up phone call. I know. All right. So how about politics? If you hate John Williams, just say you hate John Williams, man. It's okay. It's okay. James Horner did Commando. Jesus. Yes, he did. Okay.

[01:14:41] We got to keep going, guys, or we're going to run the fuck out of time. So let's do we all agree that track is better with political and social comedy? Okay. Thank you. How about plot twist with Star Trek? Okay. Yeah, Trek. I think Star Wars. Season three ending with the season four opener. Okay. Well, so Star Wars is pretty bad with plot. Yeah, 100%. There are midichlorians in your butt. Okay. So James and Travis are with? Mesa da da beans. Star Wars.

[01:15:11] Okay. You're with Trek. Okay. Awesome. So only James is with Trek. Okay. Leslie is with more. Okay. Awesome. Awesome. Optimistic viewpoint. Are we with Trek? That would have to be Trek. All right. Awesome. Honestly, Star Wars. No, no, no. They don't. Now you're just fucking with the boat. No, they don't fucking. Nah. Star Wars doesn't understand good versus evil. That's true. It does glamorize the empire.

[01:15:41] I thought this would be a fun way to kind of just segue us in. Which one has bad episodes, movies that are still trashy fun to watch? I got to go with Trek. I got to go with Trek on that one too. Right. The bad Star Wars are just bad. Yeah. That's how I'm with Star Wars. When it's bad, it's bad. I agree. Because I won't re-watch a bad DS9 or Voyager episode, but I'm going to re-watch every bad TOS or TNG episode because there's still a little something you can do. The third season.

[01:16:10] You don't want to watch Threshold? It's funny. The third season of Star Trek, the original series. Jesus, you got. Have you seen it lately? Oh, well. Okay. You should re-watch it though. Get the fuck out of here. It's fun though. I've seen this all 10 times, so I can tell you it's not as bad as everyone hates. Anyway, I will re-watch Star Trek V. I love it. I don't give a shit.

[01:16:35] Anyway, so anyone, is there no one else to quote Troy who goes with bad Star Wars? All right. Perfect. Leslie, how about you? No? Oh, Star Trek. All right. Perfect. All right. Love it. Love it. Love it. Love it. Potability. Are we all with Star Wars on this? Star Wars. Trek. I was going to say Trek. Trek. Oh, man. Picard alone has quite a few quotable lines. And Riker. I know. On screen. Right. Love Star Wars. Star Wars. Okay.

[01:17:04] Now you're just fucking with me. It's tough, but like, I have enamel pins of I love you, I know. You're right. And I don't have that of engage. Although. If you think about it, that's how we became progressive. Well, you don't have to live long and prosper though. You got Shatner with risk is our business. They should be on every single safety pin. That will make us even happier. This is like. Man, that's a tough one. All right. That's a coin flip for me. Oh, okay. I got a bad feeling about this. That's cool.

[01:17:34] That's right there. I'm going to go with Star Wars. There's a lot of Star Wars lines that have a single connotation. There's too many great ones. That's the problem. Star Wars. For sure. Perfect. Star Wars. Star Trek. Yeah. I mean, they just scream con all the time. It's just. I know. Just one word. How many times did somebody ever say, like when somebody says something, do you say, he tasks me? We are looking for some kind of creature. Yeah. That's, that's con. Yeah.

[01:18:04] How many times have you said that? That's TOS. You know. All right. So despite free dissenting votes, Roger Gildorio Wars is still going to win. All right. Now we got leadership. We're getting technical. We're going back to the tactical stuff we talked about. Which saga has people who you will follow into the depths of hell? DS9 and Voyager. Star Trek. All right. Star Trek. I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. There's some people I would from Star Wars, but it did poorly for me.

[01:18:34] Yeah. But unless your name is Luke, Khan is leaving your ass at the Death Star. Anyway. So who has better spaceships that aren't? Star Trek. Star Wars. Star Wars. Star Wars. Come on. An X-Wing? An X-Wing? I got to go with the Star Destroyers alone. I mean, my God. And the Falcon. Star Trek has more variety and a lot of sleeker looking ships. I agree. I like the franchise better, but I'm sorry. The Borg Cube doesn't have anything on a fucking Star Destroyer.

[01:19:04] I wasn't talking about the Borg Cube. We're talking all spaceships. All the ship and the Georgians. Yeah. Shuttle to shuttle. Star Wars already wins. Maquis? The Coruscant. Cardassians? As a rogue squadron, Nintendo system. I got to take Star Wars. Trust me, Gil. This is not easy. I can name more Star Trek ships. But Star Wars just has ships I would want to literally hijack and be in that world.

[01:19:33] I have to say, though, that Battlestar Galactica's Viper is still the coolest spaceship ever made. Actually, I will take Star Wars. That's because Adama for president. Anyway. I'll take the Star Wars. If we're not counting Moya from Farscape, okay. You know, if we put Jim Henson in this, then it's even more complex. But I have to say, like, I love so many of the Star Trek vessels. Yeah, they're beautiful.

[01:19:59] Star Wars has the one-man fighters. The X-Wings, A-Wings, Snowspeeders. I wish I could have met you in high school. You would have seen me being the dork in the corner eating Cheerios and making a damn spoon look upside down like an Enterprise ship. Oh, yeah. Oh, no. Same. No, same. Can I just say one thing? I mean, Star Wars, it wins it. But the one great thing about Star Trek, the Klingon ships. The D7. The D7 and the Bird of Prey. The D7 and the Bird of Prey.

[01:20:29] It looks like a creepy wombat or something. Just the way it's scaled. And yeah. When that Bird of Prey, first off, with the Star Trek, the motion picture, when V'ger appears and you see the three Klingon cruisers coming out, you're like, oh, shit. Oh, shit. And then Star Trek III. That's why Star Trek loses it. Because if we bring up V'ger, then we're just asking for a fistfight here. Anyway. But I mean, again, like, single ship. Give me the Klingon Bird of Prey. I know.

[01:20:58] But overall, out of everything, give me Star Wars. As a fan of the first five Enterprises and the Titan, I still gotta give it to the horse because I want a damn X-Wing. I want to join the fight. An X-Wing or a Snowspeeder? You want to be a fighter pilot? Yeah. Yes. I have zero experience and I'm fully qualified. I'm too tall to ever actually have been a fighter pilot. So I can live in the fantasy world of I could have been a fighter pilot. Let's just go get trained by Morpheus in the Matrix and we'll be all good.

[01:21:28] So who has better visual effects? Track Wars. Yeah. I'd have to go with Star Wars, I would say. I'm actually going with Star Trek on this, just from the Genesis sequence alone. But okay, so Soto and I are track. Everyone else is wars. Yeah. I'm sorry. ILM. No, it's fine. I said Trek. Shit. Okay. Shit. Well, we're still losing. Anyway.

[01:21:54] And that's taking nothing away from Star Trek because there's some amazing work, but we don't have ILM without Star Trek. This is why we are doing this tonight. We are making it the most impersonal thing. Oh, I know. I am loving the humor so far because we are actually making each other actually change our votes halfway through. Better escapism. Star Trek. Star Trek. Star Trek. Star Trek. Special original series. Yeah. Okay. So.

[01:22:21] I'm legit tied on this, honestly, because they're both good for escapism, but it's hard to pick one or the other. Star Trek will make you think more. Exactly. No, trust me. I love Trek more, but Wars just has the adventure. I want to literally find out about these creepy planets and find the good in them. So. Yeah. Leslie Gill. I got to go with Star Wars. And what about 1979? 1989. Star Trek, yeah. Right. So.

[01:22:51] Mike Gill, Leslie are with Trek and the rest of us are going with Wars. I'm with Trek. I'm with Trek as well, too. Who just. Roger. Both Matt's. Matt. Both Matt's. Oh, well, fuck. Okay. I think Trek wins this. Trying. Star Trek. Okay. Well, so since it's split, Oreo, you're going to break the tie. No, I'm Trek. Okay. I don't know if you had that or not. I think Trek wins. Okay. So Trek wins. Trek wins. Man. Even though they're wrong, Trek wins.

[01:23:22] I mean, Star Trek makes you think. And that's what I love about it. I agree. I agree. People have spoken. Right or wrong. Right. So better watch together or fan viewing experience. Who's going to do a fun marathon with these movies? Are you going to do it? Or Wars. Or Trek. I got to go Trek again. Okay. I got a group together to watch the Trouble with Tribbles DS9 episode. And it was, it was a hell of a lot of fun. Did you watch it with the original Tribbles episode? No. Cause we watched it live. So.

[01:23:52] There's a lot of Bill O'Reilly invading this damn conversation, doing it live. We've got to stop that. More than once. I've been in a theater for all three original Star Wars movies sold out twice. I've been in a theater for all six of the prequels and the original in sold out theaters. 12 or 16 hours, whatever the fuck it was. So I'm going to go Star Wars on that one. All right. Is everyone else going with Star Wars? Just, you're going to go have a movie night. Star Wars. I'm with Star Trek. Okay.

[01:24:21] So we got four votes for Trek. I'm also with Trek. Star Trek. Yeah. I got to go Trek based on some of the collaborations that I've done. Okay. We got six for Trek. Man. Yep. Okay. Well, looks like Trek wins on that one. So pop culture references. Star Wars. Star Wars. Okay. I'm a Trekkie, but it sounds like I'm going to be hearing more wars in the room. So. Pop culture? I'm thinking more like Lower Decks really went wild with the pop culture references. Oh, that, that, that. Right. But we're just talking just like.

[01:24:51] General. In cinema. Like, do you laugh at a Star Trek joke more or a Star Wars joke? Just any more. Star Trek. Jokes are always more clever in movies. Hey, he's dead, Jim. Right? Yeah. Beam me up, Scotty. Beam me up, Scotty. There's no right. You never. Okay. I may have misunderstood. I got to go with Star Trek then. Because I just thought you meant. You never really heard the aristocrats joke done in true Klingon. Well, how did I know you were going to bring up a cursed dictionary for the damn Klingons? Cop you cop. Cop.

[01:25:21] My mother always will rudely say, instead of kaplah, she'll say kaplop. I'm going to kaplop you. Yeah. And I'm like, don't say it that way. We're getting philosophical here. Who's wiser? Yoda or Spock? Spock. It's got to be Spock. And that's not because one is dead. No, can't do a tie. I love Spock more. But I got to go with Yoda on this. The dude could force choke us if he wanted to.

[01:25:51] Well, that's not wise. He's powerful. And he's old. Yeah, that's a power. But he chooses not to. He's an old ass piece of shit. He chooses to. Yoda knows the force and that's it. Spock's like a. Spock is really, really smart. I agree. He's smarter. But I also feel like Yoda knows a lot of things. All right. Well, Yoda's older. But. He doesn't share much of it. He's just an old homeless man. 300 years old. How do you think after so many thousands of years of living, you should speak better?

[01:26:21] If he's so. If Yoda is so smart, how come he lives in a fucking hut? You think he'd have better business sense. I actually think that's the smartest of all. Honestly. Yeah. For all that smart. Brent's actually a steal in Dagobah. You just heard his feelings. I had to just call him out. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right. All right.

[01:26:52] So Ryan and I are going with Yoda and everyone else is back up. Spock. All right. Spock. Spock seems like a nice guy who knows his things, but I don't know enough about him to judge him. It's okay. That's why. The priest. Spock. I love how you get to the newer movies and he's totally Jason Borden. He is disarming and breaking people. All right. So who's a better warrior?

[01:27:19] Is it Chewbacca or Lieutenant Commander Worf? Chewie. Worf. Chewie. Okay. One at a time. I mean, Klingons are tough, but like Klingons aren't known for ripping people's arms out of their size. Klingons have two hearts. How many hearts do Wookiees have? That's the other problem with this. They both can do. Well, here's the thing. They can both do that, but then it'd be X-rated for violence on TV. So they're not going to show that.

[01:27:49] You know? I'm Worf. Worf is a walking carpet with a gun and super strength. I'm not. I'm talking about you. I mean Chewbacca. I mean Chewbacca. I was about to say, he's got a lot of charm that man. Did you say Klingons have two hearts? Yeah. Well, if you watch the... Okay. We're not. Let's get. Let's not. Let's not get an explicit rating. Planet Earth, they have two navels. I know. I know. Dude, you know, fucking shoot through both hearts. And Chewie has two dicks. Who would win in a fight? It's simple.

[01:28:19] Okay. So... Worf. Worf. All right. I'm hearing more Worfs. So two Chewie. I'm going with Chewie. I'm going with Chewie. I'm going with Chewie. So... Worf got taken out of Chewie in an environment. She'll have his gun. So four Chewie's, five Worfs? I love Worf. Worf. I love Worf, but... I know. We love these both. I'm not trying to talk shit about Chewie. I don't like Worf. Fuck Worf. Chewie hasn't been a... How dare you talk bad about the Black Knight Galaxy. All right.

[01:28:48] Worf's fat head looks like a fatty. Chewie's going to fight like a drunk contractor. So you're just done. Like... And wait a minute. Aren't Klingons stronger when they're drunk? Yes. So... Yeah. So James and Sam, are you going with Chewie? Are you going with Worf? Yeah, absolutely. I can go with Worf. Oh, go fuck. All right. So Charlie, can you break this tie? I'm going with Chewie. Okay. Well, foiled again. Much like...

[01:29:17] It's a toss-up. Oh, they can't have a toss-up. It's Chewie. All right. Hey, no. I love them both. I would both hang out with all of them. I would love to play checkers against Chewie. Tammy can only date one. Who are you dating? I know. Worf. I'm going with Worf on this because that dude is an admiral. I love you. Well, here's the thing. I'm straight. So anyway. So who's the better? But opposite day is coming up. Now, this does not mean to dismiss it.

[01:29:45] We got some boy fiction and women fiction here. Who do you think is a better ladies' man? And we think Captain Kirk, Sisko, Pike, and Riker, or Han Solo, Lando, Luke, and Obi-Wan? Han Solo. Herken Riker. Herken Riker. Is it all of them or individually? I'm just giving you options. Who's the better ladies' man? No, I'm going with Star Trek. I think so, too. Riker and Lando are the only one. Star Trek. The rest are... Because Luke's got no game. I might go Lando, too. Luke's got no game.

[01:30:15] The thing is, though, like Han and Lando are very strong. Han and Lando... But Obi-Wan's mistaken for Jesus, so... Yeah, but Jedis have no possessions, so they don't love Lando and Han. There you go. They're fucking ladies' man. I talked to Yoda the other day. He says otherwise. But then you look at Kirk and Sisko and Riker. They all got games. I got to give it to Star Trek. I agree. Just Riker and Kirk alone. All right, it's awesome.

[01:30:44] To fight Harrison Ford's hair, we got to go with the rest of the Trek. I got to give it to Riker, just because, no fault of his own, he attracted a non-binary alien who just straight up asked him, hey, tell me about your sexual organs, commander. And he's like, I didn't do anything. I didn't say that thing. He fought with himself! Plus, I mean, the man gets into a chair and you're already pregnant. Just the way he sits down in a chair.

[01:31:14] Exactly. My stepdad looks like Riker. Like, no shot. Shit you not. He could be his twin brother. All right. I think we're... I'm sorry to hear. ...into a little something, some, you know, explaining a lot about yourself here. Just stop. Just stop. All right. So, our ladies of outer universe, we got Princess Leia, Queen Omidala, Mon Mothma, Phoenix Shan from Mondo, and we got Jyn Erso. So, or are we going with Yohura, Troy, Tasha, Crusher, Kira, Dax,

[01:31:45] Seven of Nine, Tories, DePaul, Burnham, and Chapel. And Rand. What about Rand? Rand, absolutely. Have we got about my girl, Tendi? Oh, I see. Let's do it. Let alone me. I see. All right. I think we're all pretty firm on track. Yeah. No. No. Okay. I know. I agree. She was my princess growing up, but who are you going to listen to?

[01:32:14] I'm going to listen to Yohura and the Countdown. That'll be funny. Give me a break. We come back to... I used the latest crumb a chick, though? Maybe that works. No. We come back to Bea Arthur and Michelle Yeoh. No. And in that case, I got to go Michelle Yeoh. I got to go Star Wars. Well, I get it. It's either Ming Noh, Wayne, or Michelle Yeoh. And yeah, I know. Yeah. Michelle Yeoh is awesome. Beautiful. Probably have to go Star Wars. But I mean,

[01:32:42] Carrie Ann Moss did appear in Star Wars as well. It's true. Yeah, it's true. Okay. If you want that to be that way, you're up through the tie. I'm still going Star Wars. Katie Sackhoff. You know? Yeah. Bo-Katan. Yeah. Okay. So we got... I guess I'm going with Star Wars. I've heard enough Star Wars ones. I'm sorry. Nellie Portman. Come on. Okay. So we got four Star Wars ones. James, where are you landing?

[01:33:11] Where am I landing? Star Wars. Okay. Awesome. Just the alien babes alone. I get it. Okay. Christ. This has been the best podcast. I know. Okay. So now comes the fun to do the math. Okay. Right, Kim? I have a final decider competition. And I have a tidebreaker too. Yeah. That's assuming... Are we talking about the job of the Hutz girl with the fucking long lips? I can't remember.

[01:33:42] No, no. Like the tailors. With the extra lips. Yeah. So I want to know... Sam just sent a free P.O. What the hell? What franchise had the shittiest merchandise between the brand new tape dispenser from 1983 or the crappy rebranded Spock helmet, which I put in the chat, the two images. Oh, Lord. Spock helmet. It's got to be the Spock helmet. It has nothing to do with Star Trek.

[01:34:10] That tape dispenser is so bad, though. It is, but that's the helmet. You can get yourself one of those for $600 on eBay right now. I have one. Or you could just go buy the Goosebumps alligator stapler. Why does T.P.O. look so excited? There's a lot of merchandise across both franchises, but I think these are the worst of the worst, so I'd like to see a vote on what is the worst franchise.

[01:34:40] Let me do the math first. I think only one of the two franchises had a cereal, though. Yeah, no. And I just said, the track missed out on having their spoons not be shaped like the Interpolis. Oh, my. And to Sam's earlier point, unfortunately, I think E.T. has more creepy merchandise. He definitely has more. Well, I just mean in general. I was like, don't tell me that figure's not. Has anybody seen the Batman water pistol? Oh, God. I wish you would have.

[01:35:10] I have it over there somewhere. Why? I'll take three to your tape dispenser. Yeah, I think. And the fact that that tape dispensers, you can get them for $600. There's a lot of them. It was a Japanese release in 1983, but people are crazy about it. But still, like, the fact that exists. That's cool, though. All righty. Well, you got E.T.'s finger as a dildo, so there you go. Ouch. I'm keeping you in suspense,

[01:35:38] so right now it's neck and neck. We're catching up to track with 10 and Star Wars at eight, but I got four more points to go through, so let's see. All right. And Ted Turner. I lost the conch, Turner. Cam, I'm sorry. I will have a side conversation with everybody here. I would love to talk wrestling with everybody here. You guys need to be on the Off-Topic podcast. It's a wonderful show. My other show is at Front Face Pod. I'm switching it soon, but it's at Front Face Pod. It's my old wrestling show.

[01:36:08] You can check out all our old clips and interviews and everything. And this has been a hell of a wrestling match. So Trek, assuming my math is right, Trek wins 17 to Star Wars is 12, but if we, it was back and forth. Got it in the figure four leg lock. For a while, we were pretty much going down the narrow track. Then Wars amped it up a bit. It's like, oh, the facts, oh, the philosophy. And then we came back with all the other 2000s comics and the fights

[01:36:36] and the beautiful people and see sex sells. And so that really played a bit out of mind. And then getting into just the pop culture references. Kick this ass with some Mbo Jitsu, baby. You're right. This was like a 60 minute match between Shawn Michaels and Bret Hart. Okay. This was an Iron Man match. It's the finger poke of doom 2026. The finger poke. Yeah. I feel like Shawn Michaels is more Star Wars

[01:37:05] and Bret Hart's more Star Trek. Right. He was a technical wrestler. I see what you did. I'm a big Bret Hart fan. I love Bret Hart. I mean, just the Rancor alone. That's a wrestler. Yeah. But this was a really cool battle. Yeah. Oh, you want to add one more? Yeah. Well, I'll give my tiebreaker to Trek. Okay. But it was already 17 to 12.

[01:37:35] You just gave it an extra point. Yeah, it did. Why don't you just give 200 points to freaking Gryffindor while you're at it? All right. The real winner is Lord of the Rings. But I'm going to overwrite in and throw those out for Stargate. No, I'm just kidding. Let's go, Stargate. Babylon 5. Perfect. There we go. The Expanse. No, no, no. Let's write in The Expanse, please. Nobody's mentioned Firefly. Well, it got canceled. Oh, yeah. Firefly. I know.

[01:38:05] You're about Buck Rogers. I love Buck Rogers. Oh, God. I mentioned Farscape earlier. We better. The problem was Joss Whedon was also canceled. All right. But so did Firefly. So, yeah. I'm not going to vote for one that lasted one year on the air, man. I'm sorry. It's not happening. But if you're talking one year on the air, you've got to remember NBC's Super Train from 79. Oh, yeah. Super Train. You had to bring up Super Train. You just had to. Super Train.

[01:38:34] That's the second time he's brought up Super Train, by the way. He really wants to get that point across. It's because he sneaks up on us. Who just mentioned Super Train? Jason, the smartest guy in the room. Okay. All right. No, Sam keeps bringing it up. Not me. Jesus Christ. Come on. I watched. I'm giving you credit for his mistake. Super Train was supposed to be the love boat for NBC. And I mean, it was just like the format was just love boat, but put it on a space train on a super. Yeah. It was a simple thing, but it just.

[01:39:02] It's a train in space. Which is the one that had Jacko, Sam? Because I always forget that. Jacko. Oh. Highwayman. Highwayman. That's it. Whoa. Roger is showing a medal. He won. It's not a Gorn medal. What the hell is that? The belt. The belt. NWA. If you want to add five extra points to wars, just so we can have another show. Did you vote on? Did we vote on the worst merchandise? No.

[01:39:34] It's only going to get one more point. I was, my vote was going to Star Trek because that helmet had nothing to do with Star Trek. Right. No. That's why it's great. Yeah. It's horrible. And then they had to. That becomes a miscellaneous so bad it's kind of war. Let's just say though, you guys are fucking awesome panelists. Like you brought the hurt. You did not lie. You did not hold back. And you were having fun, which was the rule number one of this.

[01:40:00] We didn't have to flip a coin like Freddy and the Jason one, which got intense. We got pretty close in that one. We did. But it kept going back and forth. I started adding an extra point. Lesser point for Trek. Back to wars. And then up. Trek gets my bar up. And then. So I will announce after this, we will be determining who has is the better of the bunch. And that will be with Alien and Predator. That's going to be even more twisted. Predator wins. Games and comics and everything. Yeah.

[01:40:29] It's going to be twisted. I can't include any other crossovers. I got to go. That's true. Because crossovers will make it a little more complicated. Yeah. Who knows? Maybe wars could have won if I included the Ewok TV movies. It's over the second. No. I know. Not with that. I doubt it. I know. I love them. Sue me. We really just went so back and forth. And it was just really, the unpredictability was the start. It was awesome. Oh my.

[01:40:59] I know. I know. And I had a great day. Yeah. You guys brought a lot. It was really animated in a good way. There wasn't ever any moment where I'm like, okay, time out. This was awesome. Just leading up to this, though. Like, Roger was passionate. Mike was unsure. Lipman was like, oh, let's go. Sam was like, ah, wars. But, ah, track. And Leslie and Gil. He's like, I can't do the math. Being math are hard. But, yeah.

[01:41:29] Leslie and Gil were just like, I don't want one to lose. But I'm pretty adamant about track. You know? So it was just so awesome. I was just like, Star Wars, Trek, and games. And so. I got a fucking Han Solo tattoo right there. Yeah. Oh, whoa. Where? Where? Right there. He's showing it. Han Solo playing guitar. He's Han Solo. Oh, nice. I love that photo. And Soto, you were like, I gotta go. I gotta be there. I am Mr. Sci-Fi.

[01:41:55] I am a militant Star Trek fan. Yes. Yeah. Me too. Jason, you kept us in the loop. You kept going back and forward. And I'm like, oh, I might have to have him break the tide too. My God. I'll tell you guys something. I went to the East Coast Comic Con one time by me and Rutherford, right? And it was big. It was like, you know, they had it in this big giant, like, it looked like a giant arena, basically.

[01:42:21] So I walk in and there's like these, I'm walking in, I pay my $40 to go in. I got some money to spend. That's not bad. I walk in and there's five guys standing there with the full on Klingon outfits from Star Trek, the motion picture. They have the whole thing on, you know, everything on it. Back in the 80s or 70s? From the 80s. Yeah. The whole, you know.

[01:42:48] And I started going, so I go, okay, guys, now I'm going to give you guys a question. What is the line that Mark Leonard says to fire? And they all look and I go, I go, the guy goes, and he puts, he puts his hand down. I go, good, good. Now, what's the name of the cruiser? And they go, Amar. I'm like, good, good.

[01:43:16] And who's, who's, who's looking after the Amar on the computer screen? And they're all looking at each other. Like, they're like, they're just like, one of the drones from Epsilon nine picked it up, picked it up near, near, you know, I mentioned this, like that's near Klingon boundaries. Well, who are they fighting? Unknown, sir. That's one of the best scenes. It is a good episode. Now, I gotta wonder though. There are other ways where you can tell who's a Wars fan versus a Trek fan.

[01:43:44] Like if I'm at a convention and I get at least one shit eating grin when I yell out, there are four lights. I do get some guys going, oh, Trekkie. Hey, hey, Trekkie guy. Huh? I like that scene. Somebody made it to me and said stood on a Lego. See, and there you're quoting from Star Trek. I am. But Wars, I almost every day I say I have a bad feeling about this. I work security. I just go, it's a trap. Well, and there you go.

[01:44:13] And then we would do the parody of that. It's a crap, you know? So, yeah. But without, without fail, my uncle who works in the IT department at Apple and my brother will almost always give a GIF that says it's a trap. Yeah. It's a trap. But no, I think, I hope we validated. So instead of just arguing endlessly about phasers versus lightsabers, you know, and all of that, hopefully we pretty much pick big, big topics. And we didn't turn into comic book guy. That's the good thing.

[01:44:43] Yeah. It wasn't that fight scene from Fanboys where both the Trekkies and Wars guys are beating each other up. I believe it was a captain's log. Captain's log. I'm about to get my ass handed to me and I don't know where to run to. And Travis, how did you feel about this? Because you are so much more diverse than all of us would movie genres. No, this is great. This is a lot of fun. I mean, because when you, when you sent me the thing about doing this and my whole thing

[01:45:13] was like, I love both. I'm the, I have a friend who, I have a friend of mine who every time the Beatles are mentioned, he's like, I like the Rolling Stones better. Like no one, no one asked you about that. We're doing it. We didn't even go there. The correct answer is the who is better. And it's, and it's the same way with that. It's just like saying REM for life. I'm like, well, what are we even talking about? Yeah. Hold on a minute. And it's like the disagreement between the Stones and the Beatles, the who is the victor. Yeah. I'll take it.

[01:45:42] I'll take it. And Leslie, was this your first podcast? Okay. Yes. Thank you so much for having me. I wanted to just make a comment that in 1978, I went to a huge convention. It was, it was like the biggest Star Trek convention you could go to. And it was in New York at the Hilton. The biggest. And people don't realize that because of Star Trek fans, really. And finally, Star Wars became what it was able to become.

[01:46:12] Yeah. That particular Star Trek convention was way more Star Wars convention than it was Star Trek. They showed the movie in a big ballroom and it was standing room only. The people were saying all the, you know, everything from the movie like line by line. And of course, when the Death Star blew up, the whole ballroom just erupted. It was insane. Yeah.

[01:46:41] And I think to myself, when people like want to put down Star Trek, I'm like, you know what? You owe a lot to the Star Trek fans because we were so hungry for anything really like that was science fiction-y. Because we loved our beloved Star Trek so much. When Star Wars came out, we like flipped out. We're like, oh my God, this is incredible.

[01:47:04] And then you got to realize too, after that convention, they were already making plans to do phase two. And that got scrapped. Star Wars movie that launched the Star Trek movie. Right. Star Wars is the classic summer movie. But Trek is the perfect example of a TV franchise can be effective on the big screen and in other formats. But to your guys' point, we think fans are toxic nowadays. How about the fact that back then, trackies were sending death threats.

[01:47:33] No more he dies, I won't have it. You know, and Jason and Travis, though, I do like the band comparison because I do feel like, in a way, like I will see some people just flat out say, I'm never a Star Wars guy. I hate pew pew stuff. But with Trek, they seem to be kind of, either they'll say, it's a dad joke, you know, it's a dad show. Or because their parents like it, they automatically hate it.

[01:47:58] You know, kind of like, which I kind of get similar vibes with that with anyone in favor of Stones or Beatles. It's like, oh, my folks love it and try to force me to raise me on it. Therefore, I already, you know, dislike it without giving it a chance. It's also just, it's a thing where Star Trek is science fiction. Star Wars is space fantasy. Yeah. Right. I agree. So they're really very different things. I know. Star Wars is more authoritarian and Tolkien's kind of thing.

[01:48:27] How about the fact that Star Wars is dystopian and Star Trek's utopian? How about the fact that Star Trek, Alien, and Terminator were like the most, even Matrix were like the most mainstream cyberpunk, you know? Yeah. That's true for a while. And it's like Wars was kind of just saying, let's frolic around. Try to be steampunk. Right. A little steampunk. You got some Metropolis designs. But then we're going to, like you say, have the Joseph Campbell meets, you know, Lord of the Rings in space.

[01:48:55] And it is all just, like you say, and we did have some guys who were like, oh, they're so different. I'm like, I get it. But they're often rivals. And so tonight. There was no rivalry at all. I know. There wasn't. Well, and that's the other thing, too. Both Ron Barry and Lucas were homies, believe it or not. But it was just fans decided to take on each other. I can't handle this. Right. How dare we have opinions? I just thought they were also very similar in that.

[01:49:22] I've never seen so much rebellions by both fans. You know, just you had fans say the fans versus Paramount. And then you had the fans versus, you know, Disney and Fox. And it's just like, man, just and the fans versus George Lucas. And we can't complain at Ron Barry's long gone. So now we're just going to complain that the different show runners. It's it's a perfect kind of like DC and Marvel. Everybody, when they are just so unfiltered, they won't hold back to where it's just like, OK,

[01:49:52] now you ruin it for the rest of us. Now we're all going to be associated with it. Like I said, it's wrestling fans. Wrestling fans. Comic book fans. And cosplay fans. Cosplay fans. Yes. Or do you think of Kathleen Kennedy stepping down and Dave Bologna taking over? I can't wait for that shit storm to be over with. That's going to be funny. Because Dave's in charge with another chick. And then when the product goes to shit, then they're going to do a 180. I guess we better go back to the medieval ages. Yeah.

[01:50:27] Follow us on the web on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram. The podcast is available on Podbean, Spotify, iHeartRadio, Anchor, Apple and anywhere else. Podcasts are available. Feel free to review our show and leave comments on any of those sites. Thanks a million for listening. It's a jacked up review show.