Puppets Week: The Best Moments of the Puppetmaster Saga (with Good Bad Flicks’ Cecil Trachenburg!)

[00:00:00] We're the winners first here in the end, alright? It's a chapter of review show.

[00:00:25] It's a chapter of review show.

[00:00:28] Oh, chapter of review show.

[00:00:50] As part of puppet themed week. That's right. We've been talking about everything. Just your science theater, sesame street. It's time to conclude it with our rated puppets. So

[00:00:54] we just figured we revisit the puppet master universe and who other than that, then good bad flex helmsman Cecil Trichenberg.

[00:01:06] Welcome.

[00:01:07] Thank you. Thanks so much for having me, man.

[00:01:08] He has the potential to become the ultimate full moon king,

[00:01:14] but he's all out of transfers and he doesn't have enough

[00:01:16] subspecies in his diet.

[00:01:18] Well, we'll try hairs for squids.

[00:01:24] For those wondering what the hell we're talking about. Okay, so Charlie

[00:01:27] Band made plenty of crazy movies you might have seen on Showtime and sci-fi

[00:01:31] channel growing up. And it's where those movies killer dolls zombies from the

[00:01:37] future other just lowbrow and yet you know hardly which it couldn't even call

[00:01:43] guilty pleasure just because of the amount of effects and comedians and other weird genre of B

[00:01:48] movie actors.

[00:01:51] Well, Charles always had an affinity for puppets. I'm not, I read his his

[00:01:59] autobiography and he didn't really go into it too much, but he's always just

[00:02:02] had this affinity for for that. So that's why so many of his movies have had marionettes and puppets and stop motion

[00:02:11] animation and all that. It's always just fascinated him. So I think that his quintessential one

[00:02:19] has to be the puppet master series. I think that while more people might

[00:02:24] the puppet master series. I think that while more people might

[00:02:33] attribute him with the Gullies movie, I really feel that puppet master was kind of his just baby. This was the one that he

[00:02:37] really, yeah. And I mean, and we're up to what I think we're on

[00:02:40] 11 now, including the, the sort this sort of reboot, uh, that

[00:02:48] startups and then there was, and then there was the spinoff blade.

[00:02:51] Uh, so yeah, they're blade, blade the iron cross.

[00:02:54] So there might be 12 now with you need someone else besides Indiana Jones to kill

[00:02:59] them not see man.

[00:03:00] So what other than killer dolls?

[00:03:02] Exactly.

[00:03:03] And that got kind of fluctuate back and forth.

[00:03:05] You know, sometimes they're good. Sometimes they're evil.

[00:03:08] And really depends on who's writing it and who's doing it that day.

[00:03:11] Have you heard of any of Charlie's new podcast?

[00:03:15] You know what?

[00:03:16] As much as I love Charlie, I really haven't listened to any of them yet.

[00:03:20] And I should.

[00:03:22] I always forget.

[00:03:24] It came out of it hit me out like a.

[00:03:27] I'll five. I was like, what?

[00:03:30] I had no idea, but yeah, full moon free show and.

[00:03:33] I only knew about it because he was interviewed recently on Kevin Lane,

[00:03:37] Spillier gods and.

[00:03:39] But like he just, like you just said, he did kind of just pretty much just.

[00:03:43] Talk about his recent autobiography book and then just say, he did kind of just pretty much just talk about his recent autobiography

[00:03:45] book and then just say, I just love to stop motion.

[00:03:48] I've been a fan since Jason and the Argonauts got and give me those effects.

[00:03:52] Sell me on that trailer.

[00:03:54] I want to make that kind of crazy movie in return.

[00:03:58] Yeah, he just has a passion for it.

[00:04:01] And I love that.

[00:04:02] I love that he more or less stuck with that until the money run out, like ran out.

[00:04:08] Like I still love Charlie.

[00:04:11] I will always love full moon.

[00:04:14] I am very torn because some of the new movies, the quality is just.

[00:04:19] But I understand that the market is just.

[00:04:22] Oh, yeah.

[00:04:23] He's been doing that with other stuff.

[00:04:26] I can't even get into Evil Bond or Ginger Dead, man.

[00:04:29] But again, I can't blame him for wanting to capitalize

[00:04:32] on that success.

[00:04:33] Like, for any, I see so many people who will hate

[00:04:39] watch his movies.

[00:04:39] And I'm like, but see, here's the thing.

[00:04:41] Like, you can't say this is the same as any of the do it yourself garbage.

[00:04:46] You've seen on Amazon Prime or crazy to be originals or even you ball type stuff

[00:04:52] where the guy just wanted to piss everybody off.

[00:04:55] You know, like this guy is just experimenting with all kinds of crazy stuff.

[00:05:00] He, he, he's a B movie guy.

[00:05:02] Like he's as close as you got to Roger Korman still working, you know

[00:05:06] Yeah, I mean and there's even in the the lower tier stuff. It's still like there's effort there and

[00:05:14] Like the the kill you know as of more recently

[00:05:18] The kill joys. I don't know if they they haven't made a kill joy in a while

[00:05:21] But it was like kill joy evil bong and they had a lot of success.

[00:05:26] They had a lot of success recently with the like the 50 foot cam

[00:05:34] girl and the gigantic attack and those.

[00:05:36] And the thing is like they, they're movies that people watch to

[00:05:42] trash to just, oh, these are awful.

[00:05:44] And so I kind of

[00:05:46] him with norsky and Fred Olin Ray. So you're like, it's a whole different

[00:05:49] pedigree all together. Exactly. Which is really sad with me because Jim

[00:05:54] Wannorsky and Fred Olin Ray, when given a good script and a budget, they

[00:06:01] they have a track record where they've proven that they can do really good movies.

[00:06:05] But anymore, I mean, they've both lamented.

[00:06:09] They're like, the market just isn't there.

[00:06:11] And they try to get something else.

[00:06:15] But then the only thing that they can do is like Bigfoot's Wild Weekend or something.

[00:06:20] Yeah, I asked the Block Pit why they seem to have counter moments and it seems like

[00:06:26] half the time they just want to fuck with fans too.

[00:06:28] And you're just like, why are you guys doing that?

[00:06:32] Are you schizophrenic?

[00:06:33] Because like it, nothing wrong with that, but it would explain a lot because like there

[00:06:36] are times where, what was it Jim was saying?

[00:06:39] Oh, I don't want to come on your podcast because it was like this one podcast called

[00:06:43] like, because it's called schlock

[00:06:45] And then he comes on this other podcast called bad movies. It's like well, what the hell Jim

[00:06:51] Yeah, really what's the bad?

[00:06:54] Yeah, what's the difference? I've had people

[00:06:58] Who have avoided me before because

[00:07:01] When they hear you know good bad f, they think one of two things.

[00:07:06] He's gonna make fun of me. I'm either gonna make fun of it or I am going, you know, I cover like

[00:07:12] bad movies and I'm like, you go to, I'm like, because usually I'll, I'll send them a link and I'll

[00:07:17] like, look here, I'm talking about a lot of a wide variety of movies or I have people that'll

[00:07:23] jump on in the comments that'll be like, this isn't a bad movie. And I'm like, when in the when in the video that

[00:07:29] I say that this was a bad movie, like I wouldn't say some snobs on your videos, you did one

[00:07:34] on Transers Free and I saw some people disagree. No, no one likes the third one. I'm like,

[00:07:39] says who he just said some fans to really like the the third transfers. That's it's always said. Yeah, like the third one

[00:07:46] You can't deny that the third one is the like the best

[00:07:52] Produced one like the third one has the highest quality

[00:07:56] I think now whether or not that translates to you enjoying it the most like I personally

[00:08:02] Love too because too was my first transfer. Yeah, it's a perfect trilogy. And really is. And actually, I just had,

[00:08:12] I was at the sci-fi horror con, I was a guest there last month. And I had dinner

[00:08:20] with all the guests, so you know, the other guests right there. And I was talking

[00:08:23] with Aria Mihiloff, if I'm hopefully the other guests right there. And I was talking with Aria Mihiloff,

[00:08:25] if I'm hopefully saying his last name right.

[00:08:27] And I, he was there to promote,

[00:08:32] he was, he was Leatherface in the third Texas Chainsaw movie.

[00:08:36] And I didn't know until he left,

[00:08:40] and I'm like, I should have checked.

[00:08:42] He was shark in Transters 3. And I'm like, oh my have checked. He was shark in Transters 3.

[00:08:45] And I'm like, oh my God, I would have just asked him nothing but questions about playing shark.

[00:08:51] Because I know that I had talked to Peter David who wrote 3.

[00:08:55] And he still has the head of shark on his desk that he works at where he had it made into a lamp.

[00:09:03] And I'm like, that's amazing.

[00:09:06] But I totally would have asked him

[00:09:08] nothing but questions about shark.

[00:09:10] And he, I mean, a lot of times you get somebody like that

[00:09:13] who he's probably so burned out on talking about

[00:09:16] Leatherface that you bring up another project

[00:09:19] that he worked on.

[00:09:20] And as long as it was a good experience,

[00:09:22] then they're more than happy to talk to you

[00:09:25] about it. But instead, he was telling me how to make homemade potato chips. And that was very.

[00:09:33] It was really cool. He was a very, he is a gigantic dude. He was very, very tall. And he was very

[00:09:40] nice. But it was very, it was really funny. Of a mark now. It's just kind of like general henchmen.

[00:09:46] People assume, oh, because you played a rapist or, you know, killer, serial killer.

[00:09:50] You must be crazy in real life.

[00:09:52] And like actors acting.

[00:09:55] It's a job.

[00:09:56] I find that usually the actors who will often play like the good guys are usually the standoffish

[00:10:06] where I'm set on time.

[00:10:09] And yeah, the lead is the one who's spoiled and refusing to remember their

[00:10:12] lines and you're like, uh, yeah.

[00:10:15] Meanwhile, you got a character actor who, uh, he's played, you know, henchman

[00:10:19] number five in 50 movies and, and is just the most down to earth nicest guy.

[00:10:24] Uh, like, Oh God, I met Angus

[00:10:27] scrim years ago on the tall man. Yeah, the tall man. And I went up and I was like, I

[00:10:33] got to tell you, you terrified me as a child. And he was like, Oh, no, he's like, I'm just

[00:10:39] an old man. Like he was so nice. And I'm like, it was just like I had this just wonderful memory of him being such a pro. Like he was jenny. I mean seriously, he terrified me when I was little and some did.

[00:10:55] Yeah, he's I mean, God, he's just boring, you know, he was amazing. So, but yeah, but then meeting him and he was just the nicest guy you could possibly get could meet.

[00:11:06] Rest in case. I know poor. I mean, I'm glad I got to meet him before his past. So there's

[00:11:13] a lot of that.

[00:11:14] Remember that. I, you know, uh, and my, my, what's where we met? I'm trying to think

[00:11:20] where we married. I think we were married at the time when I met him. I was there with my wife and she met him too.

[00:11:25] And she she hadn't seen any of the the fantastic movies.

[00:11:30] Yeah.

[00:11:30] She's just like your hubby or with your kind.

[00:11:34] Yeah.

[00:11:34] She was like, she's like, oh, you know, she's just this nice, you know, this nice guy.

[00:11:38] And he got a picture with her and she's like, I wouldn't really watch his movies now.

[00:11:43] And I'm like, oh, like, wait till you see.

[00:11:46] And so we watched it.

[00:11:47] And she couldn't.

[00:11:48] But she's like, how?

[00:11:49] She's like, that guy was so nice.

[00:11:55] Oh, man.

[00:11:57] Tough stuff.

[00:11:59] Yeah.

[00:12:00] But back on the Charlie Band stuff,

[00:12:04] I love Puppet Master too so much and a lot of people

[00:12:12] go with Blade being their most popular, you know, I think, I mean, Blade is the most popular

[00:12:16] kind of the leader of it, but it is wild because you don't always hear their names, but I got to

[00:12:22] still tip my hat to him because you love the arts and crafts the stop motion actually in a way kind of makes it freaky at times and

[00:12:29] There's just such a sense of fun that comes on screen every time

[00:12:34] That this is one of those it's probably one of the few direct video franchises that I've seen have an audience, you know

[00:12:40] Pulling in general, but it's

[00:12:43] You know some of them have gone to theaters some of them have gone to theaters, some of them have gone to TV.

[00:12:46] And so they always found a way to just stand out in some way and just kind of,

[00:12:53] again, kind of like Evil Dead.

[00:12:54] It was just a crazy B-movie franchise and kind of in many ways is like Maniac

[00:12:59] Cop. You can like it literally or in a trashy way or not so bad.

[00:13:03] It's good way. it doesn't matter just

[00:13:06] Embrace it. Yeah one way or the other you're gonna enjoy it

[00:13:10] I think when it gets to I

[00:13:15] Think it's part eight

[00:13:18] Either seven or eight. I don't remember off the top of my head, but whichever one is the clip show

[00:13:22] I know that's when people are like oh, yeah, the leg leg is starting to see the, I'm starting to see the, the, the

[00:13:28] limitations here. Because what happened was forward five. That's right. It was, it was,

[00:13:33] it was, because it was, it was, well, one was under empire. And then two was, was two

[00:13:40] and three were full moon and three was when the paramount deal was in full swing. And then

[00:13:46] that one was great. And then they got the budget for four. And they decided that they were going to

[00:13:52] stretch that into two movies, which as Charlie does sometimes. So four and five is really one movie,

[00:14:01] but they stretched it into two. And then six was crazy.

[00:14:06] Chris six was the the one with tank.

[00:14:10] Ernet or a tank anchorist or whatever.

[00:14:14] Or they're like slaughtering people out of camp and you're just like, okay.

[00:14:17] So it's kind of a Friday 13th kind of tribute show, but

[00:14:21] retro puppet master gets even more confusing because it's using stock footage and then just kind of a loose spinoff and it's kind of been rediscovered.

[00:14:29] I feel I would put this down as the best moments just because Greg's it was one

[00:14:34] of Greg's to sterile from the room's first roles. Exactly. I think it got

[00:14:38] rediscovered. Rob I mean for people that work already into the puppet master it

[00:14:44] got rediscovered by non puppet master fans people that were already into the puppet master, it got rediscovered

[00:14:45] by non puppet master fans because they were looking into Greg Sestero's stuff.

[00:14:50] And he is surprisingly good in it.

[00:14:53] Like he's really not terrible.

[00:14:55] He mentions he had trouble finding roles because he wasn't.

[00:14:58] It was one of the few movies where he's actually acting and saying dialogue, but I'm with you.

[00:15:04] I feel like he gave it as all because considering, you know, this is already

[00:15:08] a lowbrow saga, so it's not.

[00:15:11] Yeah, I mean, I think he was looking at it from the perspective of he might be

[00:15:16] able to get a consistent job out of this.

[00:15:19] Okay, here's a franchise.

[00:15:20] I might be the new puppet master guy or something.

[00:15:24] And, you know, that didn't happen.

[00:15:26] But, you know, I mean, he really tried.

[00:15:29] I should bring him back at this rate.

[00:15:31] You say, hey, oh, I think he would totally do it.

[00:15:34] I think he would do it.

[00:15:35] He totally would do it.

[00:15:36] He can laugh at himself.

[00:15:37] Yeah.

[00:15:38] I mean, God, he had no problem with all the stuff

[00:15:43] at the room and everything.

[00:15:44] So I think that now granted, they probably would have to pay him a little bit more,

[00:15:49] but cause I think they didn't pay him very much for his, but I mean, but that's,

[00:15:52] you know, that's just any actor going, you know, in a movie.

[00:15:56] But, um,

[00:15:56] but I think the first one is pretty well liked just cause it's kind of,

[00:16:03] it's on hinged in many ways. And you're seeing gruesome stuff happen to unlikable people.

[00:16:09] And there's just something about just all the tension in that whole movie that I

[00:16:13] think that's the reason it's kind of been found by so many people.

[00:16:17] It's been was a well marketed movie by Paramount back in the day.

[00:16:21] And now it's I would constantly see parts of it on AMC.

[00:16:26] And it was very just disturbing.

[00:16:29] I think, I know, I don't know how like,

[00:16:36] I don't know that details were never officially released,

[00:16:39] but I know I'm sure it wasn't cheap to fully acquire,

[00:16:43] you know, re-ac acquire all the full moon assets.

[00:16:46] Because I know Charlie had a lot of things just in a vault.

[00:16:50] And oh, yeah, I'm sure Paramount was trying to lock them down as studios

[00:16:55] often do. So I'm glad he got them because he has been remastering them

[00:17:01] and we're getting them in widescreen.

[00:17:02] And they look beautiful.

[00:17:04] They look back because that's that is the beauty of shooting on film is that you're taking.

[00:17:11] You could take these remaster and re release it and blow it up to like 8K if you want to.

[00:17:16] And it has a great sense of humor.

[00:17:19] Yeah, I'm sure you've seen this convention videos for just like interviewing people like the Lake Great Curry, Larry Cohen. And at one point he even says,

[00:17:29] if you people want me to stop making these movies, stop buying

[00:17:32] my shitty movies. I love it. I love it. I see anyone else. I

[00:17:37] mean, we love Roger Corbin, but he at times comes off as a

[00:17:41] little too proud. Like, people are just jealous, making fun of

[00:17:44] my movies at Mystery Science Theater.

[00:17:45] And it's like, yeah, well, it's gonna happen.

[00:17:48] But I love how it's just Charlie's.

[00:17:50] It's like, hey, I mean,

[00:17:53] his sense of humor is apparent in all of his movies.

[00:17:56] I mean, yeah.

[00:17:57] Well, Charlie is just a, he's a showman.

[00:18:01] You know, he's like, I am delivering what people want.

[00:18:04] He's trying to make, he's trying

[00:18:07] to make a combination of things. Some movies are the movies that he wants to see. But in general,

[00:18:11] he will make the movies that he thinks the audience wants. And time and time again, he's proven

[00:18:18] right because he's still making them now granted, he's not making them on this scale that he used to because the market is so different.

[00:18:27] And I don't if he could get in with a studio backing, something where even if he got like, let's say go back to the old days, go back to like 500,000 a million per movie.

[00:18:46] the old days go back to like 500,000 a million per movie. I think that the quality would drastically improve because the movies that they're doing now, they're making them over the course of like a

[00:18:49] week or two for like 50k and they and it's all digital. It's all bad CG. I shouldn't say all but

[00:18:59] mostly and they're just they're just not there. But I think that if he was able to go back

[00:19:05] to get that level, cause he's got the access to the talent.

[00:19:13] There's so many of the directors that he knows.

[00:19:16] And there's so much FX guys and whatnot

[00:19:20] that would be able to work under those circumstances.

[00:19:22] It would be able to deliver a good old fashioned

[00:19:25] puppet master movie or something. But I just, you know, just for whatever reason just hasn't

[00:19:31] been able to find somebody that wants to deal with them in that way. I guess there's just the

[00:19:38] David Martin is the main motion capture guy for a while and he passed away. So he's finally and I died in 1999, sadly, but so yeah, I think that more so.

[00:19:51] It's it's not even just all the effects guys, but I mean, I'm

[00:19:54] just saying it comes down to just the budget that he's being

[00:19:56] able to get and it's a bummer. But I mean, I'm still glad that

[00:20:00] he's going. I still love his stuff. I'm still happy at the end

[00:20:04] of the day that he continues

[00:20:05] to make movies. And I really do got to watch his podcast because he, like you said, he is hilarious.

[00:20:12] Oh, and, you know, he, he also doesn't hold back. He's like, yeah, we've had some good years. We've

[00:20:18] had some bad years. And, you know, one, if we know one could have predicted that we were all going to stop watching stuff on VHS and then later, now we're at the pick and choose level.

[00:20:31] Some people still want to do Blu-ray and DVD and other people are still like streaming,

[00:20:35] streaming, you know, if it's not on there, I'm not watching it.

[00:20:37] So it's, I think he's just at the predicament where it's like, if you really want this,

[00:20:43] you know, you'll come and find it and then he finds alternatives for all these other people. And

[00:20:52] out of all the sequels, which do you feel is kind of like the strongest moment,

[00:20:56] like you would want to introduce people to because like I think the beauty of this saga is

[00:21:00] if you don't like one, you're going to watch the next one. You don't have to watch it that literally or that deeply,

[00:21:10] but it doesn't hurt either.

[00:21:14] I would say across the board, if there

[00:21:17] was somebody who was interested in getting into the franchise,

[00:21:21] I would be one of two questions for me.

[00:21:22] It's like if they were somebody I knew that really liked

[00:21:26] thrillers and sort of mysteries and that kind of thing,

[00:21:31] I would probably start them with puppet master one.

[00:21:35] Whereas if they liked horror and action,

[00:21:40] like they were leading more towards action,

[00:21:42] I would probably start with three.

[00:21:44] Because three, I think is the best produced

[00:21:47] and just the biggest crowd pleaser.

[00:21:51] As much as I, as the major.

[00:21:53] Yeah, Richard Lynch is the evil Nazi guy.

[00:21:56] You know, yeah, and you've got the really good Andre Toulan

[00:21:59] and the puppets are actually the good guy is,

[00:22:04] it's just, it's a big crowd pleaser movie.

[00:22:08] And even though, like I said previously,

[00:22:10] two is my all time favorite.

[00:22:12] It's the one that introduced me to the franchise.

[00:22:14] It's the one that got me into a full moon to begin with.

[00:22:17] And I, but I don't think that it is a, like for me,

[00:22:34] because I'm, you know, I saw it in God 1990. So I saw it way back like introducing somebody to it now. They wouldn't react to it as strong. They were probably just laugh at it. And they wouldn't see it as like, I think if they went and saw three and did enjoy

[00:22:45] that, then you could go back and okay, well, look, I'm going to show you two. And it's

[00:22:49] like, you know, even though three is number three, it doesn't matter. You know, it's a

[00:22:54] story that stands on its own. They all more or less stand on their own with the exception

[00:22:58] of four and five because they were shot back to back. But, but they all kind of stand on

[00:23:03] their own. So you can kind of pick and choose, all right,

[00:23:06] I'm going to watch two, three, one, four pot, you know,

[00:23:08] so I would eventually introduce them too.

[00:23:13] Like I, my wife is more into thrillers.

[00:23:18] So I actually showed her the movies in order.

[00:23:21] So we started with one and she kind of liked that

[00:23:24] because it was more like a

[00:23:25] mystery. And then two, she enjoyed because it was so corny. And then like I said, really, she really

[00:23:30] enjoyed because it was the just the big swashbuckling Indiana Jones puppets. Yeah.

[00:23:39] Yeah, totally. And there is an unusual sense of adventure and just the music kind of reminds

[00:23:45] you of just kind of how goofy this whole saga is.

[00:23:49] It's really, really, it almost totally is like a Hogan's heroes, you know?

[00:23:56] Yes.

[00:23:57] Like, oh my God, yes.

[00:23:59] Because, yeah, it's just really silly.

[00:24:02] And I just, I really do enjoy that. And I think that going back to

[00:24:07] good directors, David Dakota. David Koto is a really good director who has fallen

[00:24:13] into a rut of making these really bad movies all at the same location. He made

[00:24:21] all those over the 1313 or yeah, just

[00:24:26] unwatchable. And you're just like, he's kind of that same

[00:24:31] fan window where you're just like, well, he used to be able to do

[00:24:35] cool stuff. But yeah, I know you can do better. I've seen you do

[00:24:38] better. But he did all those did The talking cat and all those movies.

[00:24:47] And they're there for me, I'll watch him and laugh.

[00:24:51] But in general, if you were just your average movie goer, you're going to see

[00:24:56] that immediately turn it off.

[00:24:59] So yeah, because it's just like it's it looks like a student film and you just start so confused because

[00:25:08] the decisions they're making are just illogical and you're just like, I can't, you know, that's how

[00:25:13] I am with you, Ball, where I'm like, no, that's not even Mr. Science Theater level, that's not even

[00:25:17] Elvira or Joe Bob where you're watching a goofy movie at two in the morning and you need just

[00:25:22] something to cling on to. Yeah.

[00:25:29] Oovey Ball was interesting. I interviewed him two times a few years, like God, probably about six years ago.

[00:25:32] I think that's how he got so many people on his. He could be nice,

[00:25:35] but we know him kind of just personally, you know, from a, well,

[00:25:39] public image from just wanting to challenge everybody and fight.

[00:25:42] Yeah. He, he, he got a lot of respect from me

[00:25:46] because when I first interviewed him,

[00:25:49] when I started, I was like,

[00:25:50] look, just before we do, I want to let you know.

[00:25:55] I don't like your work.

[00:25:56] I really don't like your movies.

[00:25:59] And I just, I was like, I think they're really poorly made.

[00:26:02] And he was like, that's fair.

[00:26:04] And then he talked to me and we got into why they were made that way and all and it was just it was it was very interesting and he was a lot more humble than I had suspected.

[00:26:15] And I appreciated the like I was, I wasn't going to go in and kiss his ass.

[00:26:20] I went in and sold him flat out like look to you, I don't like your work. Like there's a couple of your couple of other things that I thought were

[00:26:27] had potential and were good but in general your video game movies were got awful and they made it

[00:26:32] really hard for video game movies moving forward because nobody like movie studios,

[00:26:40] they aren't looking to see oh this one was made by Uvay Bolle and he was

[00:26:45] They are looking to see, oh, this one was made by Uvete Bolle, and he was using a German tax loophole to kind of just crap this movie on it.

[00:26:49] Quality didn't matter. They're just looking at, oh, well, here was this movie, this movie,

[00:26:55] this movie, and they were all based on video games, and they all flopped. Like, they're not

[00:27:00] looking at them from a quality perspective. They're looking at, oh, this is a video game

[00:27:04] movie, and it failed. So, but he was an interesting guy. I was very glad to talk to him.

[00:27:09] I, I, even the most infamous people are still very fascinating. Like, I can't watch any of

[00:27:14] just Franco's movies. I still want to know, you know, how this guy working South America with the

[00:27:20] Great Orson Welles and create all these bizarre Lesboe vampires stupid movies, you know, it's always hysterical

[00:27:28] just because there's a story behind every movie.

[00:27:30] And I mean, that's, I have the time back when we did physical media,

[00:27:34] the joke was by Jim Wernorsky movie and then listened to the commentary track

[00:27:39] where he just literally rips himself a new one or talks about other

[00:27:43] hysterical trivia that you're like,

[00:27:45] no.

[00:27:46] You're telling me that happened on this goofy movie?

[00:27:49] Well, okay.

[00:27:51] We'll return after these messages.

[00:27:54] Hey, it's Brent Pope, the host of Brentfist with Brent Pope.

[00:27:59] You've seen me on some of your favorite TV shows saying things like,

[00:28:02] give it up, Jimmy.

[00:28:03] You've got to sync this put to win.

[00:28:04] On Brentfist with Brent Pope, I sit down with guests for the entertainment world and we

[00:28:07] do it all over breakfast. Or should I say, breakfast. Every week on breakfast you get

[00:28:11] inside Hollywood info and tips. Great breakfast, wrecks and booty debates. Most of all you

[00:28:16] get the most delightful 30 minutes of your week. So dig in, it's Brentpo's time. Listen

[00:28:20] at Brentpo's dot com, Apple Podcast podcast or wherever find podcasts are found

[00:28:29] Do you ever find yourself thinking about who would win a fight between Goku and Superman?

[00:28:35] Hi, I'm James Gavsian on the who would win show me and my co-host re ignore anything important happening the outside world and

[00:28:39] debate fictional battles between characters from comics movies and video games We got a new show every week and almost always am I the winner?

[00:28:43] Yeah, not true right in the past. We've discussed such matches as Captain America versus Darth Vader,

[00:28:49] Solid Snake versus the Iron Giant, classic matchups like Robocop versus Terminator,

[00:28:55] and even the Muppets versus Sesame Street.

[00:28:57] That one was crazy.

[00:28:59] So if you're a fan of geek culture and love a spirited debate,

[00:29:02] check out the Who would win show wherever you get your podcasts or check us out at hoodwindshow.com

[00:29:07] Oh yeah. Well, what was this? Was it I think it was Fred Olin ray on Jacko in the in the

[00:29:19] commentary. Oh yes. And he's just making fun of Steve Latchau who's taking his movie way too seriously. Yes.

[00:29:27] Does it doesn't believe at one point? I think so. I didn't listen to it, but I

[00:29:32] remember that being like reviews of the movie and it's just like, I remember

[00:29:36] talking to Latchau online one time and he's like, well, you're comparing my movie

[00:29:40] to Die Hard. I'm basing this off disaster movies. I'm like, that's what people

[00:29:44] usually mean by it.

[00:29:45] When they mean die hard, you're emulating an earthquake or towering inferno kind of, you know,

[00:29:52] take over movie. And I don't think he has a bad, big head. And I've heard him on adult

[00:29:58] wondering thing, the podcast one time. And he seems nice. I just, I don't know. I really don't know. I think he just I mean,

[00:30:07] I wouldn't be much fun either if people were making fun of a movie I was passionate about.

[00:30:11] But at the same time, I mean, you got to be really ego headed if you think that movie

[00:30:16] is a defining moment of your career too. So I mean, I don't know. It's such an odd thing. I think some directors and producers

[00:30:28] and whatnot. They do fall in love a little bit too much with the

[00:30:31] thing that they've made. They aren't always the most objective to

[00:30:36] it. They're seeing it as this is something wonderful. And a lot

[00:30:39] of times it's just not. I'm from the perspective of I've seen so many movies that are

[00:30:46] god-awful, unwatchable. So something like that, if you're, if you worked on that and you're proud of that,

[00:30:54] then that's cool. Like, I mean, that had practical effects. I had a storyline that you could follow.

[00:31:02] It was, like, the audio was good. Like I'm looking at all like

[00:31:06] the different aspects of it that make up the film because I've seen biggies with like no white

[00:31:12] balance and CG crappy audio out of focus cameras. Stuff that's not ready for prime time where you're

[00:31:21] just like, whoa, how did anyone who checks the quality of this let this fly, you know, because

[00:31:27] if you're proud of that, then okay, you're just eluding

[00:31:30] yourself. Oh, totally. There was a bunch of guys who I would see

[00:31:33] and who are still working today who kind of made a living being

[00:31:37] screen queens and been doing all other kinds of slashers and

[00:31:40] ridiculous sci-fi horror movies in like places like Atlanta and Florida and

[00:31:47] North Carolina and you look at some of their earlier movies and it's out of print or a ridiculous

[00:31:53] price on Amazon and any of the other ones you have seen you're like yeah there's no way this

[00:31:57] played on even USA Network or Showtime like this is too like like you're saying, too much bizarre,

[00:32:05] lack of sepia tones, just shot on videotape.

[00:32:09] And like even, you know,

[00:32:13] we make fun of all the goofy movies

[00:32:15] that we've talked about before,

[00:32:17] but most of them at least had, you know, again,

[00:32:20] they followed the basics where there was a plot

[00:32:23] and there was, you know, it was limited in budget, but there wasn't too much oversaturated light and all that other shit.

[00:32:31] Like, if you talk about a stupid movie that's on cinemax or sci-fi channel they're still, they got point A, B and C down it's just a matter of, you know, what are the plots, any fun or not, you know, it's just, and you know, these movies were the guy where it's like,

[00:32:47] whoa, I, yeah, how to inherit anybody that this.

[00:32:53] I like some, some movies just there, they're unwatchable.

[00:32:58] And I, I am very forgiving when it comes to lower budgeted films.

[00:33:06] I am like, I think the bigger the budget,

[00:33:09] the less forgiving I get.

[00:33:10] Like if I'm watching a $300 million movie and it's got bad special effects,

[00:33:17] then I am going to just really lay into them about that.

[00:33:22] Because it's like you have all the money in the world.

[00:33:25] You could have afforded to fix this. You could have afforded to make this look good.

[00:33:29] We break up on this podcast, you know, and we're always bearing on whether

[00:33:33] we come in or out. At least you can still hear us and everything. We can enhance

[00:33:37] various parts of it. But yeah, then we see some of these other movies and shows and we're like,

[00:33:43] okay, so the money just went to the star who was there for two days

[00:33:46] because there's nothing else that makes sense about this.

[00:33:49] It's just or you like in the cases of something like

[00:33:55] the Green Lantern movie, for example, that came out.

[00:33:57] There you go.

[00:33:58] You go.

[00:33:59] The effects in that were awful.

[00:34:01] And I actually ended up talking to one of the guys that worked on it. And

[00:34:05] last story short, they did these really amazing looking effects. And the director came in and

[00:34:11] was like, no, these don't these look wrong. They need to look really, really, really fake.

[00:34:17] And so they were like, all right. And so they, they went back and they took everything they had

[00:34:23] and made it look really, really, really fake.

[00:34:25] And then what happened?

[00:34:26] Everybody hated it.

[00:34:27] So that's the case of where that was just a misfire from the back.

[00:34:34] The same with Godzilla 98.

[00:34:37] They had done all these practical effects and then the Sony guys took it over and said,

[00:34:41] let's add all these other CGI on top of it.

[00:34:44] And it's wild how, you know, Roland Emerick,

[00:34:47] you know, is in love with themselves.

[00:34:48] So he was cool with Dider 1.

[00:34:49] So it's just like, I hate, I just don't understand

[00:34:55] why people just don't seem to realize

[00:34:57] there's too many cooks in the kitchen

[00:34:59] that it just always seems to come down to.

[00:35:02] And then they get down to the finish line

[00:35:03] and kind of like bonfire the vanities,

[00:35:05] they pull up, you know,

[00:35:08] which is covered on the plot thickens podcast

[00:35:10] by Turner Classic movies.

[00:35:11] I love how they always go, we like this movie,

[00:35:14] but we don't know how to sell it.

[00:35:15] I'm like, you didn't think about that

[00:35:17] before you greenlit this movie?

[00:35:21] The offer, which covers,

[00:35:23] which I recommend the mini series

[00:35:24] that talks about the making of the Godfather is another example to and it's one of those where it just reminded me on how no one wants to make a giant epic. Some people wanted to talk about, you know,

[00:35:46] something like Lawrence of Arabia, which was good, but most people didn't see the uncut version of

[00:35:50] for a while. Then there's Heaven's Gate, which everyone fucking hated at the time, but some people

[00:35:56] like now. So, you know, it's just, and we still will have other free hour epics, but it seems like

[00:36:02] it's got to be like kind of a Chris Nolan thing. I think he's the only one who people will leave alone now. Yeah, he somehow just

[00:36:11] the knob maybe someone of that. Yeah, the heaven's gate got fixed. What happened was

[00:36:20] the studio re-edited the film and released. Yes, they did. Yeah.

[00:36:25] And it just every did it.

[00:36:27] And the, like, one of the producers, I believe the director had gotten a hold of it and worked

[00:36:34] with the criteria on and was able to put out, like, the proper director's cut.

[00:36:39] And then it got reassessed and it's like, oh, oh, now we see what it was going for.

[00:36:45] And now they're saying that the movie is great.

[00:36:47] And it's like, well, I am always leaning

[00:36:50] in favor of the director.

[00:36:51] Every now and then, a director will do some go-headed maneuver.

[00:36:54] And the movie will end up failing for it.

[00:36:57] But at the end of the day, I will always

[00:36:59] sign with the directors simply because it's

[00:37:02] their name that's on the line.

[00:37:03] If a producer comes in and alters the film,

[00:37:06] and then a movie comes out, and that version flops miserably,

[00:37:10] the producer doesn't get shit for it.

[00:37:13] It's the director.

[00:37:15] I'm with you.

[00:37:16] There.

[00:37:17] Yeah.

[00:37:18] But yeah, Brewster was on Andy Richter's podcast.

[00:37:20] They've known each other since his hysterical sitcom.

[00:37:22] And she's been on a bunch of stuff, Criminal Minds community. talked about you know if you're on a tv pilot that doesn't take

[00:37:30] off uh they almost always blame you. They're like oh well this star has been in a lot of shows

[00:37:37] that have been canceled. It's like I don't have anything to do with the damn scripting and presentation

[00:37:41] or how it got scheduled

[00:37:51] Yeah, they just want to look for a scapegoat and it's always somebody who is not one of the money people

[00:37:56] It's not like the idiot that made the terrible decision to change

[00:37:59] Something, you know, it's not right and that's oh well I talked to the director ballistic experts this ever and he'll he's not proud of it either. I keep teasing him do release the directors got you know but same kind of deal Andrew Stevens who's made it, it's, it's just funny to how people assume,

[00:38:26] you know, same thing with the script.

[00:38:28] The writer's guild is such bullshit.

[00:38:30] If no matter how many times you rewritten it,

[00:38:33] they will only blame, like, or give it to whoever started

[00:38:39] as same thing with directors and just like, well,

[00:38:43] the Wizard of Oz had freaking 30 directors back in its day.

[00:38:46] You know, there is, it is possible to have a lot of names without it necessarily being

[00:38:51] bad.

[00:38:52] But you know, it still is hard to believe at times.

[00:38:54] Like my sister always gets tense when she sees five writers in the credits.

[00:38:58] She's like, I don't know.

[00:39:00] Community cooks.

[00:39:01] Yeah.

[00:39:02] I always crack up when you see something like that, where it's a movie like the Flintstones.

[00:39:08] Absolutely.

[00:39:09] And there's just 10 writers or something.

[00:39:12] It's like, why did this take so many people?

[00:39:16] And then you watch it, you're like, for that, like, for the most safe adaptation.

[00:39:24] And it took that many people.

[00:39:26] And it's like because it went through

[00:39:28] so many different hands.

[00:39:29] And I find it is possible to have a movie

[00:39:33] where you have three, four, five writers on

[00:39:36] and the end result ends up being good.

[00:39:39] But I think that there is a better chance

[00:39:42] if you have like one or two writers and that's it.

[00:39:45] Promise. And then there's a high, more often than not, we'll find that if a movie has less

[00:39:53] writers on it, the quality of it is almost. Absolutely. I'm okay with an actor ad living

[00:40:00] something, but don't tell me, you know, I must love this if, you know, and

[00:40:05] now, you know, we have our cell phones and other stuff.

[00:40:07] So if anything happens behind the scenes, it's more than tabloids that ruin a movie.

[00:40:13] And, you know, it's even, it gets even more annoying when you encounter a snob

[00:40:19] and you're having to tell them, Hey, you've heard bad things about this movie,

[00:40:22] but have you actually seen it?

[00:40:23] Okay, you've lost the right to make fun of it. You know, if you haven't seen,

[00:40:27] you know, you still got to watch something like Waterworld or Van Horizon or

[00:40:32] virtuosity before you start lampooning it because every movie has an audience and

[00:40:37] you know, Puppet Master is one of those two. It's kind of critic proof. Everyone's going to

[00:40:41] watch it out of morbid curiosity, killer dolls. Oh, is it funny? Is it goofy? Is it freaky? It's kind of

[00:40:47] everything. And if I had to recommend any of the sequels to

[00:40:52] wrap up this, I would definitely say I kind of like the demonic toys

[00:40:57] versus movie. Oh, yeah. Much like Dalmon. It's just very

[00:41:02] easy to go to the laser traps are bonkers,

[00:41:06] bananas and Corey Filman's kept in check on, you know, unlike any of these other 80s

[00:41:12] husbands who would often just, you know, be misbehaving and barely a movie came comes out of it.

[00:41:18] But it moves along very fast. I dare I say a little too fast. Like that's my only complaint is that it's

[00:41:25] too. Yeah. But I don't like I don't dislike it. I just I wanted more is kind of the thing.

[00:41:32] Which was so surprising because I saw it was one of the lower rated ones and then I saw

[00:41:35] it. I'm like, this is more of a bow versus Python kind of movie is that kind of, you

[00:41:40] know, happy little TV dinner movie. Yeah, you watch it and it's like, happy, happy, little TV dinner movie.

[00:41:45] Yeah, you watch it and it's like, OK, you maybe don't really remember very much the

[00:41:50] next day, but you know, but at least you weren't looking at your watch saying, you

[00:41:55] know, I could have watched that live when it premiered on Sci-Fi channel and not

[00:42:00] been like some of their other movies just, you know, looking at my watch, waiting

[00:42:03] for something better to come on.

[00:42:04] and like some of their other movies just, you know, looking at my watch waiting for something better to come on. Yeah, it's got 15 more minutes of this and then I can flip over to battle starter laughing or whatever.

[00:42:11] Yeah, something else.

[00:42:12] Stargate's on.

[00:42:14] Yeah.

[00:42:15] So, see, so I didn't realize you were involved with those recent documentaries.

[00:42:23] Would you care to promote some more of those? I've been meaning to check them out.

[00:42:27] Yeah, yeah, if you are looking for

[00:42:32] probably the best way to describe it is if you're looking for multiple hours of recommendations.

[00:42:39] That is the in search of darkness trilogy. One,, and three. One, we cover horror. It's all about 80s horror,

[00:42:48] so we're covering the more mainstream stuff with part one. It's the front and the 13th of Halloween.

[00:42:53] We could not do 80s horror and not talk about those. Two, we went off into a little bit more of the

[00:43:00] obscure stuff we were talking about, some of the lesser known horror films.

[00:43:05] And then, three, we went really obscure.

[00:43:09] We're talking the direct-to-video stuff,

[00:43:13] just a lot of very bizarre films.

[00:43:16] And we got all the people involved that made the films.

[00:43:21] We got John Carpenter.

[00:43:23] We got so many different directors

[00:43:26] and producers and the special effects guys. And then you got people like me who are, you

[00:43:33] know, we grew up with these genre movies and now kind of make our own content where we're

[00:43:39] lovingly discussing these films. And so,

[00:43:43] you have a wonderful audience on YouTube.

[00:43:45] I still see people who will light up and say,

[00:43:47] Cecil, you know, yeah, I am very lucky

[00:43:51] that I have fostered a really cool audience,

[00:43:54] people that just are there because they love movies.

[00:43:59] And I think that's one of the things that is different

[00:44:03] with my stuff versus a lot of other movie channels

[00:44:06] is there's a lot of the other like really big channels.

[00:44:10] They just, they hate so many movies.

[00:44:13] Consequently, you have fostered an audience

[00:44:17] that is going to be very snobbish and very, unfortunately.

[00:44:21] You know, anti-moving with me.

[00:44:22] It's like, I get on there, I love movies and I pulled in a lot of other people that are like, oh, you're dry with

[00:44:30] trivia as well and started into your narrative. Thank you. I always said,

[00:44:37] when I first started doing this way back in 2010, I was like, I'm not using radio voice. I'm not

[00:44:46] eating somebody else because there's a lot of people that

[00:44:48] play characters and there's not, you know, more power to them.

[00:44:51] But I am myself. I'm using my voice. I am. It feels like

[00:44:56] your voice because it feels like passion is coming through

[00:44:59] because I see other people. And it's very clear they're reading

[00:45:02] off a script their girlfriend is written. It's like, no, it's not working. It's not cutting because it's, you're just reading off all the trivia

[00:45:09] we've already read about on IMDB and Wikipedia. You've got to make this stuff, you know, yours,

[00:45:16] hell, maybe reach out to these guys, get their take on it and they can blast all this IMDB stuff.

[00:45:21] You know, and then I see other people still in each other stuff. I was like, can you mind citing it?

[00:45:26] I always try to cite the other podcast

[00:45:28] I heard some trivia on.

[00:45:29] You know?

[00:45:31] There's other channels out there

[00:45:35] that they'll take your stuff and just repackage it

[00:45:40] and make a top 10 list or something.

[00:45:42] It's just infuriating.

[00:45:43] It's like, oh, yeah.

[00:45:44] No, I just did all that work for you.

[00:45:46] It just to take it easy.

[00:45:48] And now you added your blooper signature or imprint

[00:45:52] on top of my imprint.

[00:45:53] That's so not cool.

[00:45:55] I am so important that you do.

[00:45:57] But exactly.

[00:45:58] Then they don't do anything.

[00:45:59] And then, I mean, don't get me wrong.

[00:46:00] You already got to get past the trolls who

[00:46:02] are going to make fun of.

[00:46:03] Oh, you got a bluster on your face.

[00:46:04] I'm like,

[00:46:05] that's so helpful. Thank you, Mr. insecure troll in Bulgaria,

[00:46:10] wherever you are, you know, talking shit. Yeah. Yeah, you're

[00:46:15] welcome back anytime. We'll keep scheduling some other fun

[00:46:19] stuff. And we're gonna premiere this in a very soon in a month

[00:46:23] where we talk about puppets.

[00:46:30] Awesome. Yes, send me a link and I will send it out. We were both kind of breaking up a bit, but I think we're still acceptable because I'm going to put this from the level later.

[00:46:34] Okay, good. Yeah, I mean, you came through with me. So, yeah, and I could still hear what you're

[00:46:41] saying. And you know, this happens on Zoom. It doesn't matter how many times we do it. You know, it's.

[00:46:45] Oh, yeah.

[00:46:46] Yeah.

[00:46:46] It's the Internet.

[00:46:48] It's always going to take a poo.

[00:46:50] Glad we got some B-movie lessons here in this process.

[00:46:53] We talked here and there about Pop and Master,

[00:46:55] but it was ultimately about the definition of crazy cult movies.

[00:47:00] Yeah, I think it's a variety.

[00:47:03] It'll be for people who want to listen to all kinds of stuff.

[00:47:06] We'll get all kinds of ideas.

[00:47:08] Absolutely.

[00:47:09] Awesome. Thank you for having me.

[00:47:12] I appreciate it.

[00:47:12] Yeah, I didn't know if you could see what I'm doing.

[00:47:14] Oh, you're doing the spot.

[00:47:16] Thank you.

[00:47:17] Yeah, I'm sorry.

[00:47:18] I'm such a geek.

[00:47:19] I don't know where you're saying.

[00:47:21] I got to know.

[00:47:22] I love Star Trek.

[00:47:23] I just was like, I'm pretty sure that's what you're doing. But yeah, I know. I'm making. I got to know. I love Star Trek. I just was like, I'm like, I'm pretty sure that's what you do. But yeah,

[00:47:27] I know I'm making an Albert Pian reference. I know like three

[00:47:31] throw it up gang science. Yeah, no, I'm referencing the substitute.

[00:47:35] I'm referencing Vin Diesel movie. I don't know what I'm referencing.

[00:47:41] Some crazy B picture that I'm ashamed to know. Anyway, got speedy. Keep kicking ass.

[00:47:47] Thank you. And I appreciate it.

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[00:48:11] Thanks a million for listening. It's a chapter we've used so

[00:48:32] It's a chapter we've used so It's a chapter we've used so

[00:48:34] It's a chapter we've used so