Dating & Friendships Roundtable Part 1 with Reena Watts (Better Call Daddy Podcast), Oreo Brewer & Max Sycamore (Bitches with Beard Podcast)

[00:00:06] It's a Jacked Up Review Show I'm your host, Solee. With me is partner in crime, Oreo, and he decided we got to talk about the dating scene. Damn, Skippy.

[00:00:53] You've interviewed me once, and she's interviewed Tonya Butter, mind-blowing guest. It is Reena Watts from the Better Call Daddy Podcast. Thank you so much for having me. Welcoming is also Max Sycamore from The Bitches with Beard, who I've also been honored to be on Roundtables with.

[00:01:09] It's lovely to have a chat with everyone tonight about dating. I'm sorry, it's such a shit show. Hopefully we won't make it a shit show. I hope I could provide some guidance in the dating scene.

[00:01:23] You did, dude. And it's awesome that you're an hour away. I did not know that before. Do you think that people are ever ready to get married?

[00:01:34] Let's see. This is what I like about these questions. Anyone who says this is easy, well, this wouldn't be a question if this was easy. I would say generally no, and I'll say why. And I like how you're opening up this whole discussion platform.

[00:01:56] And I am not here to be a cynic or anything or just down be negative. So like take for instance, like I have a cousin. Rizlyn got married. She's a nurse. Totally qualified great science background.

[00:02:13] I think she was ready for marriage because not only did we get to see who her, you know, soon to be partner was, but one of them was kind of a, let's just say he was a lovable giant teddy bear.

[00:02:27] And it was just more, you know, just could be funny one minute and serious the next, you know, and it was just a matter of just reading their body language reading just how they absorb all this information and how organized they are with day to day life everything from cooking to let's

[00:02:46] get ready for a party let's get ready for work so I think they were at that age again you know in their 30s. Yes, I think they're ready. Now, generally, it does seem like there are many they, they want to get married as soon as you know, they had puberty and it seems like to answer your

[00:03:07] question kind of gets to that point where is this their mind is racing, but they're never asking the magic question. Am I ready? Can I do this? Am I doing this just to show off? Yeah, is our love actually going to last? Am I going to be faithful?

[00:03:26] Are we marrying just because we're obsessed with each other but not necessarily in love? You know, so I think there's a lot of love.

[00:03:34] It obviously does mirror a lot of dating, you know, I've been on a few unofficial dates. I've been at networking events. I even took some colleagues who were in the same area to stand up concert once upon a time.

[00:03:47] So unofficial dates but it was just one of those is like, you know, I think it's it really does come down to a lot of the questions we're going to get into how serious is it and it doesn't seem like it's often is like yeah

[00:04:01] I think it's like that and alongside like kind of having your shit together. Yeah. Should we bring kids into this situation and like is that required? I'd wait six months to a year for that.

[00:04:16] And Oreo you've been in a few, you know, you've had you've had a fiance once upon a time and I know that's very good point on the kids right now because it seems like those are the ones who ultimately get hurt. Yeah.

[00:04:32] And I kind of had enough experience because I had many friends who were divorced. And they would talk smack about one of the two parents is like, oh, she's so mama, you know, or my dad, I always

[00:04:49] Anytime anytime it's his day to watch me I just go to my friend's house, you know, and just come home for dinner. So it does seem like to have all that hostility built up I think also accounts for a lot of the same kind of

[00:05:07] Just distrust for lack of a better word. Gotta be ready. You gotta be ready for it. I'm gonna be upfront. I've been married eight years and I went through dating hell and my husband went through dating hell and I watched my friends go through dating hell.

[00:05:27] And a joke that me and my husband have is that I'm, as you might tell from my accent, I'm not from America. My husband is from America. Really? Yeah, I know it's a subtle British accent.

[00:05:42] But we always check we had to be in pool because just we couldn't deal with the dating scene out in country and not that we actually met purely by accident I was on vacation over in Washington DC. Now that was definitely meant to be. Yeah.

[00:05:59] That travel was the best travel you ever had. Yeah, I'm a very, I mean, I've got a lot more outspoken since I became a podcast because you need to be outspoken.

[00:06:14] You know, we were we're very much the perfect fit for like our different cultures but I went by dating in England was horrendous.

[00:06:26] Because it was the same atmosphere versus somewhere else even though you have multiple accents and shit in different cultures is still the same dating with nothing new to offer.

[00:06:37] And we're not very outwardly emotional. So it's basically just two guys that's looking at each other going, you know, and you're like, It's very, it's almost like a job interview is like how can I do better at the next one when you're giving me these white lies.

[00:06:54] It is. It was like you're not telling me how I could do better.

[00:06:58] Oh no, I always joke that every time me and hubs have an argument we get one of our single friends to come over and describe their last dating experience and all of a sudden we're like, oh wow this seems a lot better, you know. For now. For now.

[00:07:17] But no dating. No, couldn't imagine it. Couldn't imagine it now. Do you have any like horror stories of like bad dates. Um, the fun deal. The fun my one.

[00:07:31] I actually was very lucky that I didn't go. I said I didn't go through a horrendous time. I had a guy that strongly on for about six months.

[00:07:42] And it was just like he didn't want it. There'd be no messaging and then all of a sudden on like a Sunday, he'd be like, Hey, do I go get a drink? And that's because he was bored. You know, and he wants someone to go into the club.

[00:07:54] Yeah, and then he get in the club and all that. And you've heard all the appropriate responses. So you're just like, yeah, he just wants someone to be here. I'm basically. Yeah, almost feel like an escort. You know, I'm not.

[00:08:11] You don't want this person actually here. You just want to look important. You know, it's yeah, that's why I never went to prom growing up. I would get.

[00:08:22] I would get to all our high school stories because it does play a part in our adult lives but I would see so many people they just wanted someone to go with.

[00:08:30] I'm like, but you don't even dance or you can't even stand each other in class. So what.

[00:08:37] I think the worst thing was that also I had a lot of friends who knew that I was, I mean, I was a Blake Bloomer and then you know, I'd been out for a while but then I.

[00:08:47] I got into dating a bit when in my mid to late twenties and I had a friend who was like, oh yeah, no this is just not like dating code stuff.

[00:08:56] And I was like, no it's not this is what sex in the city. I mean I love six in the city. Yeah, but there was like, what's the what's the code? What's the code? You know you can't you know you can't take for three days.

[00:09:08] I'm like, no that's so toxic now. You can't live by that and I had no I'm this guy would not try to predict. So how do you handle the sidewalk rule? What was the sidewalk rule? You don't know the sidewalk rule?

[00:09:27] Oh, you're like out six in the city. Yeah, I learned about the sidewalk rule a few weeks ago. I'm even though what it was okay and then my friend explained it. And the guy should walk on the outside if he's walking with a woman.

[00:09:44] Okay, yeah, I didn't know it was called that. We just thought he was being dumb. I have my moments. But is that like the one where you meant to the man is meant to sleep closest to the door in the bedroom? I've never heard of that. Me either.

[00:10:04] It's interesting. No, I haven't heard that. I'd be a liar if I said I had. The man is meant to sleep next to the door. The closest to the door for protection? Yeah, that's that's that one.

[00:10:16] But then that me and my husband's obviously being a shock heart to everyone who can hear my voice to men. He sleeps on the left. And this is why I love this is 2024. Yeah, we don't have any of this phobia.

[00:10:30] So it depends on it depends on like the room but he has to sleep on the left now to sleep on the right because God if he slept on the right he'd snore like a son of a bitch.

[00:10:41] But no, there is that there's all these stupid stuff and I mean I dated this guy for six months and he was so toxic purely because I had friends going. What is the dating role? And that's the dating role.

[00:10:53] This is I'm like, no, he just was being a non-committal piece of. And they're going out with what they've heard and you're like that doesn't know. I'm talking real life.

[00:11:07] So when I talk to my mates now my bestie my ever my co-host on on bitches it bids and he's now re-entered dating scene.

[00:11:15] He'll come to me and he'll come to the hubs and they'll go what do you think of this and we will be blunt as anything with him.

[00:11:20] We are just like, oh, we're not too we're not too dismissive and we do like to encourage but at the same time if he comes back with what is his own son I'm like yeah that's not good. Like, it's true. It's not so easy.

[00:11:33] It's not that hard to say to someone, hey, do you want to go for happy hour? Happy hour is still important. Yeah. Do you think it also for under our two main guests here, do you think it also goes back to just kind of reading the room?

[00:11:50] Oh, we got to be able to read the room. Right, but I just even just rule number one like if this person who you're let's say you're at a party and talking to one of the strangers.

[00:12:02] If he or she is walking in the opposite direction that's kind of your cue that it's nothing personal they don't want to talk to you. They're shy. Yeah. And my sister would sometimes do that to some friends on my.

[00:12:15] Okay, he or she has already avoided eye contact with you multiple times. They've always said not into music or movies and you went ahead and just blabbed about him. Super heroes and convo. Danger will Robinson bad don't cease the conversation and then your room.

[00:12:32] Yeah, no, I'm not. I'm not a boss but it's just so funny then finally the person is being over polite and saying I got to get a drink which is their cue for I want to leave this. It's interesting.

[00:12:46] I know what what have you noticed a lot, right at the many social gatherings you've been at.

[00:12:51] Well, I recently put on like a cocktail party. It was a two hour meetup and I've been going to a lot of meetups in town because we just moved to Houston and you hustle man.

[00:13:03] I've met like cool people at all these other meetups. I was like hey I could just like gather a few from each one I've gone to and then put on my own so I did that.

[00:13:11] And what was interesting is people like knew each other. A lot of people knew each other from different events around town so the conversation was like already starting and some of the other events that I've gone to like I've seen them do like an ice breaker so I kind of like

[00:13:28] I was like cool mingle and then I like worked my way around the room and was kind of like okay in five minutes we're going to go around and we're going to say like our favorite breakfast and do you have a podcast want to podcast or do you want to guest on a podcast.

[00:13:43] But I kind of like topics now.

[00:13:45] Yeah, so I kind of like think to them for coming but then like let them intermingle because I didn't want to break up the magic that was happening and then like gave everybody a heads up that I want everybody to know each other and we can all be friends.

[00:13:59] Right, you're not you're going. You will know everyone's name regardless of where we leave each other or business card you know, yeah, that's an amazing host line. I'm glad you did that. That's cool. It was really cool.

[00:14:12] It was so cool to do I said I'm really fortunate my husband's a very outgoing upstate New Yorker and yeah, trust me as a British guy, even my parents are like, does he ever stop?

[00:14:27] He's the guy that goes into a party and he'll go to the drinks table and he'll see someone and go, hey friend, what's your name and he makes everyone feel welcome I'm very lucky to have someone like him.

[00:14:39] But I do think that we've lost that even so I know it's about dating but I'm going for a period now why I'm trying to friend date people. I like that term friend because my husband's realized that I don't kill two birds with one stone.

[00:15:00] He's like basically saying you need to have friends and and but it is hard to go into a party or any social situation and just walk up to people.

[00:15:13] It's like, oh God, are they going to show me or they're going to yell at me or they're going to be like, Oh, hey, you're cool.

[00:15:21] And then I don't get why it's so hot and I do get whites hard because I am more shy than your home body and stuff to have the crown placed on your head.

[00:15:33] But it is so weird because the one thing he says to me is like, if I have a lot of people kind of come at me he's always like, you know just be fortunate people want to talk to you and that she.

[00:15:43] So I always feel that if I go up to somebody that party and I'm like hi my name's Max. How are you? And they kind of like you're like, are you?

[00:15:54] What why are you here if you if someone I'm not trying to have sex with you. I'm not trying to do anything. I just want to say hi.

[00:16:02] I want to know who you are. Yeah, and I'm so hard to be people that closed off now they won't allow that at least communication. People are still stuck in COVID mode. And it's really sad. Yeah. Oh yeah. No, that's good point.

[00:16:22] Like everything was good and then COVID hit and then everybody just stayed in COVID mode. Just practice at the grocery like literally start talking to all the cashiers. I did that recently. Oh my God. I was at the grocery yesterday.

[00:16:36] I will be devastated with some of my favorite grocers leave. I've made friends because there's a coffee shop like in the grocery that guy is so proud of like his new concoctions of different things that he's tried and I just wind him up.

[00:16:50] I'm like, I play into it. But I enjoy it because he's so excited about you know his samples of the day. I try every sample whether I would ever buy it or not. And then I usually go back to like the drink I like. Wow.

[00:17:05] Because you're you're pleasing him and building him up and giving him good self confidence. And then you go back to what you usually do but then he knows that you respect his craft enough.

[00:17:17] That's a good point. Because most of the time when you're in customer service you kind of have your invisible shield up because you're afraid of the inevitable person who is angry and going to explode on you.

[00:17:27] You know, it's nothing personal but they need someone to say you know hey why is my you know just anything like I have friends who are in it they're always ready for the whole you don't know what you're doing you know insults or I worked here for 10 years.

[00:17:42] So it's awesome that when you're coming up to these people you're making their day and they may not even realize it because they're just you know. He's like I don't even drink coffee but I get the responses from people that like it I'm like, that's freaking hysterical.

[00:17:58] It's actually not uncommon there's a lot of people who are like, okay so my grandmother.

[00:18:03] Bless her soul. I she was a teacher and much like her mother before her who was also a wonderful person who I had the honor of also knowing they both were made wonderful quiche. Oh, that's a great brunch. That's a such wonderful good. Good.

[00:18:22] We need to do a food podcast sometime. I make quiche. I come from quiche. My mom made quiche my grandma made quiche too. It's such a good brunch because you're underrated. You serve it and everything yeah.

[00:18:36] Hey this is something that should be on like must have lists like need to know or like. Yeah, definitely. If you're a basic culinary arts, you can win a lot of people over easily, but some people don't even want to try for that. For thought. Literally.

[00:18:55] Like it's not that hard to make a small little culinary party. I look at all these cookbooks I've covered from different fandoms and some of the party ideas that are put together automatically I'm like dude, you can do a themed party. Planner gig. Yeah.

[00:19:11] Anyway, so it's gonna blow it. It's gonna blow your mind. So not only grandparent a quiche. Didn't like it. You would never know that because of how buttered up and yeah well cooked. Organize with the crust it was. But yes.

[00:19:30] They did have the party planner attitude so I think that's what ultimately did them in that's why. And that's just commitment. I think it's just I think it goes beyond just like a celebrity I want to make you laugh I think it goes into.

[00:19:46] I want to put smiles on your face I want to.

[00:19:49] I'm gonna be able to live with myself knowing I've done something good it's just this very rare selflessness and I know you've been fortunate rain it to know people in the industry who want to get everyone coffee before they even ask can I get a cup of coffee and all these other stuff.

[00:20:02] That's how I got promoted at nanny 911. Isn't it interesting. I'm not a production supervisor but I was memorizing coffee orders I'm like how do I keep this role how do I go from.

[00:20:15] Night shift to day shift is make the head editor that's in charge of all the other editors love me I'm like we need to get you your own coffee machine I need to know how you like your coffee with your time card.

[00:20:31] I'm not gonna be able to do it because I work in video production now. Oh you do. Yeah, I was so I do video I do need a production for an organization. Thank you.

[00:20:42] He's but I don't I mean I wish I could be more creative with it but I love my job but when I was in England I was training up. I used to train young people in media production. Oh cool.

[00:20:54] I think they would say to me what can I do best when I get on a film set and I said can I do better. The director likes his cup of tea. 100%.

[00:21:02] And I said when he's looking stressed when the directors looking stress and you all come to the tea. Because it was a British the rumors are true. He's already trying to get the various personas to behave and make the studio happy beyond budget.

[00:21:15] And the rumors are true the British we need our tea. And you go up to director and go I made you a cup of tea. Can you have any pudding if you don't drink the tea? My girl needs her tea too.

[00:21:29] Yeah but just do it just learn how to make it like if you're going to get into anything learn how to make that that drink but it's even down to the point when I first was like dating my husband like I was out here we were here for Halloween I

[00:21:43] was like a very heavy night and bless his heart he tried to be a cup of tea using the coffee maker and it was the worst company he's ever made in his life.

[00:21:53] But he was so full of love that I was like I think I can marry you right this know you said earlier when do you know if you're ready to be married I'm like my husband's trying to boil tea in a coffee maker.

[00:22:08] I mean it's full of love and you're like going. Thanks but that's not how this works. I have a good embarrassing story I mean I've made my husband like really bad like instant chai is to like when he came to my apartment at the beginning but like.

[00:22:22] Reena you would bear is somewhat what. Oh my God when I was single I truthfully like ordered a lot of prepared food like I definitely was just going to Trader Joe's and picking up like an egg salad and like a wrap you know what I mean.

[00:22:35] But I know when I got married I did not know how to cook I am not going to lie I literally bought out so much and so I went to this like fruit stand and vegetable market like you know an outdoor market I picked up all these vegetables

[00:22:50] and you know fresh fish or I don't know and I just threw it all in together and all the spices and I just came out with a huge smile on my face and I knew nothing and he was just it was a guessing game he was like chicken.

[00:23:03] I'm like no. I'm not going to be allergic to this. I was like okay this guy's a keeper I'm like he's got good home training you know. I never made it again because I could tell it wasn't good but.

[00:23:22] Have you I have to ask if you have you learned to cook since then or have you not have you just like this is not my.

[00:23:29] That's a great question I don't get too adventurous but like my aunt when we lived in Kentucky for a couple years she's very into cooking so she taught me how to make some like key items. I actually can make a really good meatloaf I learned.

[00:23:48] What else I can bake bread I make my yeah I've learned how to do that really well. Damn that's marriage material. But like I buy dessert unless it's pie like I make a really good pumpkin pie.

[00:24:03] That's good you should I mean you're welcome everyone here's welcome anyone else I know would go I'm jealous I'm not a jealous guy that I'm impressed that's salmon I've gotten better at that I did learn like little key tricks like you always need to soak salmon and lemon otherwise it tastes super fishy and then with chicken.

[00:24:22] Yes, you know you got to pull the skin back you got to wash it really good you get the spice under the skin the oil under the skin. Yeah, there's like little tricks so I've gotten better I wouldn't say I'm a pro.

[00:24:34] Can I ask if we're talking about dating how long did you date your husband for before you married him. Yeah that's a great question. I've been dating life like before. Okay, so this is a little crazy I was actually engaged prior to my husband and.

[00:24:53] Oh my God scandal. Big scandal and we met on the Jerry Springer show. What are you what? I've heard you talk about will cause all these other people I had no idea. I did get promoted before I got my office but you know. On it on it though.

[00:25:16] I didn't realize he was actually on Springer I thought he was just a producer. Wow. Yeah we were both producers on the show.

[00:25:23] Oh no so I thought that I kind of a division of you like like throwing a chair at him and going you're the father oh I love you I've met you.

[00:25:31] That would have been awesome and that would have been yeah apropos but yeah so I broke up with him and then took like a super long break. Like quit smoking got into yoga took a job at nanny one like worked third shift and then got on J-date. Whoa.

[00:25:48] Yes and so he was like a grad student at Berkeley we came from like, I don't know I mean we had stuff in common but truthfully I just thought he was like another Jew from the south and I liked his hat so he was wearing like fedora.

[00:26:02] I thought it was a cowboy hat I was like all right. So he came down from the Bay Area, which is like a six hour drive and we met on Venice Beach.

[00:26:13] Yeah, it was nuts and then my cousin who was like super protective of me like blocked my car in on Venice Beach.

[00:26:21] After our like 12 hour date he was like you're crashing here and he's out yeah and so we ended up getting engaged like four months later and then we got married four months after that we never left.

[00:26:31] We never lived in the same city and I feel like we didn't even really know each other. So I mean you mean I've had the same experience then do you think it's just the environment was distracting from what you guys were actually seeing in each other.

[00:26:46] I think that he was 32 and I was 26 and we had both like stood at our own two feet and kind of knew what we wanted. He also had been engaged before, and I think all of that like yoga and not dating and taking a year and a half off from sex is like super it makes you very clear in what you want.

[00:27:04] I got everybody beat on that shit. It's true. I mean no that's but that's so cool that there was this coincidence is like you both. It made my husband and never lived in the same country that when we got married like we had been we've met.

[00:27:21] I was on vacation we really liked each other we stayed in contact and we did two months off and one week on and two months off on week off and six months in we.

[00:27:34] Surprise me and came over and propose in front of a shit ton of people now you know. How do you feel about public proposals. I got a public proposal to. How do you feel about that.

[00:27:47] What was your one not being a you go it was in front of my grandparents my best friends from growing up it was like Russia Shanna lunch at my grandmother's house and it was funny because my cousin like brought home her boyfriend and they had been together for like years and so my husband like went up to that guy was like are you going to do it.

[00:28:05] And he was like no and he's like all right so he stood up and it was like that answers that. So were you were you pre engaged or were you just not that you didn't know that was coming.

[00:28:14] I didn't 100% know it was coming although we had looked at rings so. So you're kind of pre semi engaged. Kind of we were talking about it but I didn't know it's now or never. I'm not waiting. So that was cool.

[00:28:29] So my one was like we met in the October and he came over for the Christmas in England. Like my parents were completely shut because they knew I'd been out for a while but they'd never met a boyfriend because I'd never really had one and like they were.

[00:28:46] Like met this guy and he was like they were kind of like we liked him and then we've done a couple of bumps on and off and then I knew something was coming because we discussed it because I we wanted to live together marriage was the only way we need to afford with it.

[00:29:02] So come the June and it was Pride Month in England. I was proud over here as well. And I was volunteering for a LGBT switchboard hotline and they he'd been involved in like the husband had been involved in like the people I was working with.

[00:29:20] And so just before the day before Pride, they were going to do a big gala because they were like well it's our 40th anniversary we're going to rebrand blah blah blah blah blah blah.

[00:29:31] So the husband had been he couldn't come over for it and he was like well I'm going to stay I'm going to Toronto actually because that's where the Pride that weekend I feel bad I'm missing your thing but and all that.

[00:29:42] So I go to the vein and it's at the Hilton on Sharsby Avenue and it's a really nice event and they're like hey I was a bit pissed off because trying to buzz my husband right my then boyfriend saying hey you know I'm looking

[00:30:00] at me in my suit and he was ignoring my phone calls I'm like I don't know why he's been a dick or this sort of thing. And you're tired of waiting for his answer because you know it's not going to be acceptable either way.

[00:30:11] Yeah I'm trying to be excited and he's like being I can't talk right now and all this and all that.

[00:30:16] So we go to the vein and they go hey Max hey do you want to like can we give you like this like name tag because we might need you at the front because if you because we want to get some photos and and do you like

[00:30:27] this since your photo being taken for publicity on yeah yeah sure. So I go in with a nice time go to the front and it's like it's a huge room there's like 500 people there. And yeah I'm glad you're guessing that that no one's ever happened next you know.

[00:30:45] No no we're standing there and I didn't have to be an odd number. Yeah and they're like going to me and technically but whatever but they would collect some standing there and we're having a drink and they go okay.

[00:30:56] The program's about to start but before we begin we've got a special guest coming over for America and he has a very special announcement to make. And they start playing our song and I'm like what is this song.

[00:31:09] It's not it's not it's a it's a known song but it's not a known song I'm like this is my name is song so and then all of a sudden my my boyfriend walks out on stage sings pulls me up on stage.

[00:31:26] And during the immigration interview they're like what were you thinking about where do I put my beer because I had actually a Heineken in my hand and I was trying to walk down the stairs like this like matrix style trying to put the beer.

[00:31:39] Because I knew that wasn't get proposed to but without like you know actually having a beer he proposed it was very sweet and it turns out my parents were standing right behind me and I was like it was it was so American.

[00:31:54] But it was six months in and like I know that should if we have kids I would say to him straight away. Never get engaged within the six months never ever marry someone and go to a strange land within 15 months like. I broke strangers in a strange land.

[00:32:17] It worked it worked but I broke all the rules I'd ever give any kids of mine you know and my parents were like the week before we're saying we were having a drink and my parents were like what do you think of JB and I'm going to be interviewing me about the engagement.

[00:32:34] Like. Yeah I did the same thing with my I proposed six months and and everything was right she felt so right but we were too young and it was our first actual relationship.

[00:32:52] I was 24 she was 23 and we hit it off like we talked on plenty of fish and then she drove an hour to come see me after our conversation that same night. And it was it clicked at the beginning and then six months in.

[00:33:18] Obviously I'm proposing and I did it in a photo shoot at Sears. And it was everything was just so magic and I made it magic and retrospectively like I knew we weren't ready.

[00:33:36] I did it because I thought I was ready and I was proving a point and I stupidly I shouldn't approve. But in the end. I'm not. I'm not. Me.

[00:33:50] No but it was a beautiful photo shoot and everything fell together and then she ended up cheating on me and it was just a bad situation because her mental illnesses and shit.

[00:34:05] And it really hurt but take the illnesses away and she was a good fucking woman so good but retrospectively very naive to we were both naive. But in that I don't regret dating her. She was a lesson for me for both of us.

[00:34:27] And I tried to make amends years later and she went here. And I was like all right fine.

[00:34:34] Just trying to ask why you said you were making amends because I have done a lot of dumb ignorant shit in my life I have said some horrible fucking things to people.

[00:34:50] And I am doing better in healing myself because I've got PTSD and C PTSD and autism and ADHD and I've been through so much or shit that it made me realize that I need to do better by people.

[00:35:11] And I have apologized to so many people for what I've said or done the one thing I did recently was apologize to so I apologize to a friend of mine that showed up at the gym.

[00:35:28] And I was like what the fuck did I do this past weekend. I hadn't seen her in a couple months and the last time we talked she compartmentalized me to texting.

[00:35:36] And that was because I was aggressive about one that sex with her and shit. And she said we could have a play date but then she just rejected me all together.

[00:35:44] And I was like fuck you whatever and then I saw I was like you know I got a little apologize to you and she's like why I don't even remember what you did.

[00:35:52] And I said I accept your apology and move on or explain I was like I'll explain. And I told her you know I was aggressive about one sex with you and I should have been aggressive.

[00:36:03] And I'm sorry for that she's like, I accept that and I appreciate that a whole lot.

[00:36:09] I'm teasing how so many people appreciate that I did the same thing to another friend of mine but it wasn't ever sex it was over a mutual friend of ours died from anaphylactic shock.

[00:36:22] And yeah, he, oh my God that dude was like a second father to me. He was so goddamn good.

[00:36:31] He loved his son so much every time we got done at the bar. He's like let me tell you about my boy Brad, every fucking night we wrapped up part after before and after. We were talking about my boy Brad he loved that boy with all his heart.

[00:36:47] And he was dating two different women. He was dating Carol, and then they broke up and then he was dating my when he was with my.

[00:37:00] And I looked at her and the first thing out of my mouth back then this was 2011 I was like, oh God I wonder how Carol feels. And I was like, I'm fucking idiot. And then I ran into it.

[00:37:15] Okay, happening to you for you to put it together see that's how harsh you were being. I know because her the look on her face it didn't register back then for me I was like why is she just giving me a blank look what about Carol.

[00:37:27] We'll return after these messages. If you like small town mystery, crazy news and wild history than the Florida men on Florida man podcast is for you each week. Josh Mills and Wayne McCarty bring you the absolute best Florida has to offer.

[00:37:46] So if you're looking for a show that's safe for the family but funny enough to help you escape everyday life then listen to the Florida men on Florida man podcast. That's Florida men plural on Florida man podcast. Apple podcast or wherever fine podcasts are found.

[00:38:33] The jacked up review show podcast is honored to be part of the blind knowledge podcast network. Join anytime talk the talk and enjoy yourselves. There's something enlightening for everyone with this crowd of cool cats. Check them out.

[00:38:52] And then I saw her in Walmart years later actually just past year or a month and last year and I told her is it you know I got to apologize to you. And she's like, what for because she was taken aback by that.

[00:39:06] And I was like, you know, when Paul died, I told you that, you know, I was worried about Carol fell and I didn't think about your feelings at that time because it didn't register.

[00:39:20] I was like, Oh, that's okay. But I appreciate that. And, you know, apologizing and making amends with people feels good because more weight comes off of me.

[00:39:33] And those don't wait on you for real like I'm not like my anxiety is pretty much non existent. I don't have the urge to pick up my scabs as much as I used to.

[00:39:49] I don't touch my head anymore. I don't get upset. I don't get, I don't get fucking angry and like I used to sometimes I can settle up and not as bad of like, but looking back at everything bad I've done and everything shitty.

[00:40:07] You know, it was a life lesson and losing key people in my life. I lost my best friend in 2013 to an overdose that broke me.

[00:40:19] It did like me and her, me and Crystal were cancer twins, peas in a pod got along didn't even need to say words to each other. That's how organic we were. We just, that's so fucking cool. And I, yeah, it was so fucking amazing.

[00:40:38] And it took me a long time to heal from her. I didn't go to her grade till last year, full decade after her death.

[00:40:50] And I remember I forced myself to watch her go in the ground because I needed to have that melody. I needed to know, you know, she's dead, she's gone.

[00:41:02] And at first it clicked and then it didn't click. And for so long, it hurt. And it was, there were nights I was on the floor, bawling my eyes out over her because she was gone and I didn't have her anymore.

[00:41:20] And then it was just, it took so long to heal from that. And I lost relatives along the way but they didn't hurt as much. But hers was the catalyst point for me that really broke me.

[00:41:36] And healing from being broken really puts everything in perspective. And then when I went to her grave last year on our birthday, because we'd never spent a birthday together, I hated that we spent it this way because you know she's dead, I'm still alive.

[00:41:54] And I understood why she OD, I understand. Like I have a great perspective on why people commit suicide. Hers was an accidental overdose but I understand why people do suicide.

[00:42:10] And it's rough to understand that because if you are so close minded, you don't get it. You'll never fully understand it unless you have someone that you lose that goes by suicide or just dies of the no-winters or whatever.

[00:42:25] And you have to understand from outside perspectives what it is for them in their mind. And I understand that locking yourself in a room or inventing doesn't do it.

[00:42:37] It doesn't work. Like I had so great why I had YouTube because one, I get a lot of people coming in left and right giving me feedback but also it's helped me when I do my about me that it's because if I'm having a problem I do a bit on it and confront the issue versus letting it faster.

[00:42:57] And confronting all these different issues I've had has helped me so much. And then I had to go through so much introspection, retrospection and tracing everything back to resources and that's fun.

[00:43:12] You learn so much about yourself as you're older and the thing that really pisses me off and it's so stupid is that I know so much now and I hate that I can't go back and tell my younger self, hey this is what we're not supposed to fucking do.

[00:43:30] And it irks me every day like I learned something new and it's like, I wish I knew that back then. But my favorite. That's why you shouldn't date too long. Honestly, good point. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:43:45] My longest relationship, my fiancee, my ex fiancee was 23 months and then I'm me and Bella were currently deep friends we were dating for a long time but I've known her since 2019.

[00:44:04] And we met on Twitter and it's wild that we met on Twitter because I thought it finds me like that. And we hit it all fast friends deep relationship and then the long distance got to her.

[00:44:19] And she's like really ruined the relationship and she's like, you know, you should find and she's a New Zealand bottle. So the time difference is a pain in the ass.

[00:44:27] So I'm up at like two and three in the morning wait talk to her that she's doing school and stuff.

[00:44:34] And she is such a phenomenal woman, one of the best and I'm grateful that when I was younger I said I hope I find a woman that when we break up.

[00:44:48] She is a good ex and Bella is because I never understood that premise like why the hell were you friends with your fucking ex they're an expert or reason I learned.

[00:45:00] They actually have benefits and it's not the sex ain't the sex. It's their, it's how they carry themselves and how they treat you and how whether or not they want to stay in your life or not. And stop in a Bella and going back 2002.

[00:45:21] When I was in high school I was with. Yeah, so more man. Yeah, you're so young like, yeah, I know it's a lot of us like alcohol and smoking and just trauma thing. So, 2002 I won a girl walk past me and shit clicked.

[00:45:49] And she became my crush and I saw her walk by me I'm like, damn it my heart skipped a beat that day. I still remember that. Total cliche 90s romance right.

[00:46:03] And I said to myself like I hope I see her again. And few days later, ran into her again.

[00:46:10] And I was in best it was a behavioral program in my high school for everybody that had behavioral problems and shit I was in there because I got arrested the year previous for indecent exposure of high school, my friend. Wow.

[00:46:26] My friend, Daryd me to pump a tree with my dick and balls out and I was like, fuck it all day. Yeah, we get a little blood here guys just awarding it. But yeah, but yeah going back to this girl Jess Brown love this woman so much.

[00:46:43] And she came into the room. And I was sitting at the computer doing my work and she talked to me now to put it in perspective. I was shy as fuck back then.

[00:47:00] I didn't talk to barely anybody. I mean I talked like circuit there's levels of talking all our levels of talking there's your surface talk or like hey what's up hey bye bye bye.

[00:47:14] Literally and then you have your, you have your sub level is your medium levels are high levels and shit and she engaged me in conversation.

[00:47:25] And she was one of the poppies along to school and I never it still blows my mind to this day that she taught me.

[00:47:34] And she showed me what was in her purse she said she was spoiled and she had her next tell cell phone, next tell trip was the shit back then annoying as hell and garbled with funny.

[00:47:49] Um, but yeah and I've well I remember I looked at her so many times. While she was working and she would sniff her hair to think she'd be tapping her hand. She had on her white shirt black skirt shoes.

[00:48:08] And she was just so beautiful. And I got so hooked on her. And I'd actually worked up courage to ask her out. And I saw it as me being done back then I saw it as you know me and her will be a power couple.

[00:48:29] And I didn't know it's like on the tablets. Yeah, like we're going to be a power couple will be the best thing ever. And she told Mr. Schrader or counselor she got back with her boyfriend and I my heart broke.

[00:48:44] And I was so depressed over that but my love for her didn't quit. And at that same year attack of the clones that come out so I had written a story or story about me and her.

[00:49:01] And I kind of met that shit like that story that whole saga has all of my personal issues that I've dealt with and through writing that I have conquered every single one of them and I'm still working on them every so often should have popped up

[00:49:18] and I'm still bringing the word home with that. I wrote her poems. I wrote like 18 or 20 poems for her. And it pissed off one of her axes. He was going to beat my ass at the bar the one night, like you were 3040 poems.

[00:49:36] I'm like, yeah, what you got to do. He did good to make a move at the bar the one night to beat my ass and one of my friends at the time actually stood in his way twice and stopped him from doing it.

[00:49:53] And this is like a Jerry Springer saga right there. Yeah, my comes around to we got to have you read that poetry and then brought the boyfriend out. I wrote her so many beautiful pieces and then she would have had to pick.

[00:50:10] But the sad is that to this day, he doesn't know what she's done for me like because of her. She will now. I told her two years. Bring her out. I gave her two years ago in an Instagram mess message and post and she blocked me.

[00:50:37] And that forever to send her this episode and tag her just tell me your name. Wow, good luck with that. She's a hard ass like he she goes by my house every day.

[00:50:53] I feel like create something in your mind though that like wasn't real right like we do that when we're young. I got hooked on her and then the character and then they were intertwined and then I got older and I'm like, oh fuck.

[00:51:08] I fell in love with the character versus her. And that's what happens with online romance too like, I don't think that should go too long like, you know, you guys are into it each other look like and then meet in person and like I,

[00:51:22] I've even like carried on some of those situations like way too long where I like made them something that they were and then you meet them once and you're like what the hell is my thinking.

[00:51:33] Yeah, because as I'm older, I'm like, she's yeah she's not who she really is. There you go. And what kills me is she goes by my house every day because she takes her kids up to practice for sports and stuff.

[00:51:48] And she just blatantly ignores me. I wave at her she's nourishment. Like where's that white shirt and black skirt I was thinking about. I really think about that. Like, because of her talking to me. I was able to have an amazing writing talent come forth.

[00:52:08] I have been able to talk to women, which is amazing because back then I know how to fucking do it. Now I do. And I'm still learning because there's so many things that I keep learning and it's amazing to learn all this shit.

[00:52:23] And she's she gave me good self confidence and for being someone with autism like fuck, having self confidence and being able to talk to somebody, especially if it's in a romantic way or trying to get romance is challenging

[00:52:42] in itself because you don't know whether you're going to be rejected or if it's going to go forward or if they're just going to be boring as fuck.

[00:52:52] It's like you're going to be a huge or wanting sex. I've had hate that that pisses me off. And there's one line that I will absolutely get I will gatekeep this shit till I die and I fucking hate it.

[00:53:07] And it is, I wish I could find someone just like you.

[00:53:12] You know, I hate that shit like you're a good friend. I wish I could find someone just like you. There's no one just like me bitch I'm sitting right here. You'll find facsimiles and life but you will never get the original.

[00:53:31] And it pisses me off. I hate that line so much because that destroys everything going forward. I think we're better off as friends. That's tough. Yeah, I hate that. Like I get friends. I don't do friends. I don't need a friend zone thing. Yeah, no.

[00:53:48] It's either yes or no. I don't get two hours extra in my day just so I can like go on a happy hour with a friend who I know won't like me. Yeah, I'm not going to do that.

[00:54:02] It's about reciprocating if you can reciprocate off plain and simple. If you don't mess with me if you don't buy it's all about the organic vibe that you get with somebody. If it's organic, it's gonna last. It's gonna work in some way shape or form.

[00:54:20] Whether it's to your benefit or theirs.

[00:54:23] But I've been on dates where like we've chatted online we've been on so I started I mean I'm you know honest I'm 39 so I started online dating when you had to use a desktop and again I remember when it came about you could use the phone.

[00:54:42] A phone? Do tell ya. Yeah, I was on the road to the road to it. I actually do remember my parents had a road to you for. Yay! I still love the tone of them but no.

[00:54:57] I remember going to my like a day and I was I was chatting to go on Tinder and it was really cool and we're talking about musical theater. I said I know oh my god I'm sexual to my musical theater.

[00:55:10] But we were getting on so well and then we went on this date and I don't know the second we looked at each other. You know if you've ever been on these dates where you're like the energy just went.

[00:55:26] And I don't know what it was and we went he goes hi and I went hi. Yeah and it was so stupid. I hit him.

[00:55:43] We went to his pub and I bought the first round because it's like you buy in England you buy like one round and you buy the second round. And then the question is is the date going longer?

[00:55:58] Are you going to buy the who are you both going to go to that okay we go to the third round this is suggestion this can be saying more.

[00:56:06] No actually that's it he bought the first round and I went to buy the second and while waiting for this to get served I checked my phone and my mum had emailed me and I buzzed my mum back and went hey mum why do you know I'm on a date and she went.

[00:56:21] Your mother knows everything and you would not be on your phone check your emails you kissed too many frogs and I was like whoa. Damn. Thanks mom. Yeah but also I do call my husband my prince because of that.

[00:56:40] And I'm like yeah but it was such a bad day I mean and then literally we got to two drinks in and I was like I think I was like oh God I got an early start.

[00:56:53] He goes great it turned out we lived down the same road we had to walk home together. And then I just slide in I would I'm going to my building and I went in and I hid around a corner.

[00:57:07] Because there was like a fried chicken place nearby that was like oh yeah I'll get some fried chicken and beer and the next two hours were the best two hours of that night but no that was not the worst day where you're sitting there you're kind of going.

[00:57:22] And this is where big this is big evidence that like online doesn't always work because we were so like compatible online and we met in real life and we're like. No. Yeah my worst day was a one night stand. This bitch.

[00:57:41] She invited me over because she didn't want to be alone. Because she wasn't I know. I'm sorry you're a red flag.

[00:57:51] No no that's a no no that's a no because I'm not I'm a nice guy I'm extremely nice and I'm like all right I'll stay the night because you're scared and shit.

[00:58:01] And we want and going back to sex in the city we've been watching some of the hat. And I know it's fun that series I need to be watching it's so good.

[00:58:14] I've been watching that made out for a while and started to get hot and heavy and she's so sad. She literally went down on me up down up. I'm tired. Wow, I didn't know you're pretty grumpy here but okay. I didn't even I'm like, what? Okay.

[00:58:39] So we go to bed I wake up. Want to have a little fun and she's waking and baking with Dawson's Creek. That's an ideal date for me actually. You're determining the date based on the TV program. Just like getting stuck watching Dawson's Creek, I'm up for that.

[00:59:00] But maybe this should be like a pre qualifier question. I guess so yeah. Like, are you a TV person or not at all? What are you watching in the morning after?

[00:59:13] Like morning I'm in the mood and shit and she's like, yeah that's nice but I'm watching Dawson's Creek. And I'm like, and that that hurt that really hurt my fucking feeling something. I didn't let her know I went downstairs and I just do it.

[00:59:33] I went outside had a cigarette and cried because I'm like, wow, she doesn't want me at all. She rather watch the fucking show and get high. And that hurt and then yeah, that really killed myself esteem for a long time.

[00:59:51] And I mean what do you think marriage is going to be like. That's why I'm not for marriage. I'm really not like the only way I'll ever get married.

[01:00:02] Yeah, if the only I'll ever say I do is if she proposes, if any woman proposes to me, I'll say I do. You got the only way I ever put your contact information in the show notes.

[01:00:20] I had a 40 year old virgin on my show and he got four responses, but he was super picky. No wonder he was still a virgin. Yeah, I actually got him potential people that were like willing to go on a date with him after he told his story.

[01:00:35] I was like hell, I would feel good about myself if I made somebody a match through my podcast. So I was like maybe I should try that. Oh my God, I'm gonna get you. I've got some mates that need I need them with people.

[01:00:48] No, I think I'm going to give people a shot. You know, tell your story. Talk about what you're looking for and if there's somebody in my audience that connects to you and likes your laundry list of expectations by all means. I need that actually.

[01:01:06] My husband is not my expectation whatsoever. My life is never what I thought it'd be. But I love that. I was the opposite of that.

[01:01:16] No, but I'm just even now he's outside. He's singing and he's I told him he's gonna cook dinner tonight, but also because I'm I know that I'm unbelievably likely of a man like this because we are just the right people for each other.

[01:01:32] And it's hard and it's not easy like so he doesn't take some work. He takes work. It takes people to realize they're in the same place like he's he's involved in local politics. Yeah, interesting day.

[01:01:50] And the first thing I buzzed in was like, do you want to go get happy hour? There you go. I'm saying to him, do you want to go get happy hour? And do you want to tell me what happened? And he went, I actually really would like that.

[01:02:05] And then at the end of the year, I'm saying to him, I'm going to go do a podcast. Would you honestly mind cooking dinner tonight?

[01:02:12] And he's like, yeah, I'm sure I can hear him sing outside and he's like, but it is about a lot and you're going to always feel at times shit and at times really good about yourself.

[01:02:26] But I like me and my husband are very lucky that we met each other because you know, we're often two sides with different countries. And even though that like we're both obviously the American England is is is not the biggest difference. At least times only.

[01:02:47] Yeah. And I'm just I'm just so lucky to have him. But I also do know that is

[01:02:56] shockingly bad to date people at the moment. And I live in Washington, you see my bestie Daniel who could not be here on the on tonight in my podcast house is just in a perpetual he's just not doing well dating because

[01:03:12] DC is a very gay city. Like it's it's a lot of young as wild. Yeah, we should totally do a poll on like which ones are more inclusive obviously if it's a more backwards less progressive state that's going to impact DC's

[01:03:28] gay to the level of like you go to other cities and you forget that men aren't gay like it's a hateful one. Yeah, it's everyone we meet is just like homosexual.

[01:03:39] But also the issue of that is that he goes on dates and he's like my best mate and I think he's just the most awesome guy going but he cannot meet people because they have high expectations.

[01:03:53] There's such a level of well there's something better going to come along. I don't want to settle for this if I date this I'm setting for this I'm like just why don't the people just go on like dates and get to know each other.

[01:04:10] No, like speed dating was going to speed dating but you know what if you if you go on a date with someone you're not signing a contract to read that or two or three to know each other. Exactly. Just to say you did it.

[01:04:27] Just like, you know, I barely I barely cuts my husband's you know you're like it's not hard. It's just like I'm.

[01:04:38] I think when when I was a when you know tonight it was I was asked up to about dating I felt bad because I was like marriage but at the same time I watch people and go oh my God just my my advice of dating is chill out.

[01:04:55] Literally, I don't expect shit because I don't be fake. Yes, you hate your life too so why I've noticed this with certain actors have been around like you can tell if they're going to goof around if they're still acting.

[01:05:10] Yeah, the minute was cameras just turn off and it's like I want to talk about that today with Kate Wendell interview. I don't know about that.

[01:05:24] She was in an interview with a figure out who the girl was but it was her first time doing an interview with anybody.

[01:05:34] And Kate told her that you know okay so we're going to do this and we'll just go through it bit by bit and make it the best interview ever and it turned out to be the best interview ever for her. Shit. No it was awesome.

[01:05:50] But dating, dating sucks sometimes. It doesn't suck. People need to let go of expectations I used to be so. It's almost like these interviews we've all organized this is like. Yeah.

[01:06:05] When I when we came up with this concept when Rita and Max both agreed to this, I was just like, yeah, the idea is to have an open discussion. It's not too, but we're going to approach it just like any interview where we're not going to just say, and this is where it's going.

[01:06:25] If you want to stay and just, sure, you can say that beforehand before we record but no we want raw answers. Yeah. It doesn't make sense to say and now we're structuring it this way. That's true because when you when you segue from one thing to another.

[01:06:47] It makes it difficult for some people to understand but when you go into the dating scene itself like you can't really have expectations, especially your subconscious ones and people will swear up and down they don't have them but they don't have expectations.

[01:07:03] And if you let like I had when I do dating I used to be very pretentious about the shit. And I was very pretentious. I was very particular. I was bluntly honest and people they're like, you're too full of yourself.

[01:07:24] And I have no expectations with dating because I know that everybody comes and goes for different reasons and going back to losing my bestie.

[01:07:36] And that day you can't save them all. And another thing I learned is that sometimes you might be coming across somebody and you might be interrupting their karma that they're going through. Hmm.

[01:07:49] And one thing, like I give anybody a chance of dating I have given numerous people chances of dating me. I even dealt with a racist bitch at one point. Oh yeah definitely call me a fucking Sam and I'm like, yeah, because I wouldn't tell her my real name.

[01:08:08] I'm like I go as Max just for the record guys. Yeah.

[01:08:12] Yeah, like I go by Oreo because I prefer that I don't like my birth name because I have dealt with so much narcissism with a narcissistic sociopathic gas lights in my mother and I cannot stand her and she's really ruined my birth name for me so I don't go by that no more.

[01:08:31] And this chick got so pissed about that she's like, oh, I'm talking to a skater I'm like, okay then bye.

[01:08:39] I'm like, I'm not gonna stop her I save what she said and post that shit and one black woman on Twitter commenters like yeah I give everybody a fair chance to but wow. I was like yeah, I'm fair about shit.

[01:08:54] It's all in how you present yourself if you come off. It's also what energy you put out to and I've learned that going forward.

[01:09:03] You put out bad energy. That's what you're going to get if you put out good energy that's what you're going to get kind of goes back to the customer service like I'm talking about earlier is like

[01:09:13] you wouldn't do your be your best if you have just been called every insult in the book. It's just not. I don't know anyone.

[01:09:25] You really do get your way if you're nicer though my battery actually died this week on the day and we were a little upset about it because it was under warranty.

[01:09:38] And it's supposed to be a four year warranty and this has never happened from like auto zone or if you order something on Amazon you tell them doesn't work they take it back immediately but if you order a battery from Walmart.

[01:09:49] They were running all kinds of tests I'm like okay we bought a new one my car started we put this one in it didn't start please just switch them out and give me my 200 bucks back.

[01:09:59] And we did not ask in the nicest way my husband's a little irritated and we had other plans but we tried the not so nice way of saying hey we have the receipt and you don't need to run a test we already did the test and then that didn't work so we went to a different Walmart.

[01:10:17] And tried to be a little nicer and got the 200 bucks back so you know trial and error. Say things and it's the same thing with podcasting too right like when you first start telling me like the whole over the place.

[01:10:32] And the more you tell it you solidify and you realize what hits with the audience and what doesn't resonate. Correct. That's what dating is kind of like to. Yeah, you're like are you didn't like that story I got another one. There's more.

[01:10:49] There's always more is you go back to everything like if you look at the first person that really changed your life.

[01:10:58] You go to where you're at now with who you're currently with thing you're like wow what a change in perspective they have a tiny ounce of what that person used to be. You can't escape the full you but you can.

[01:11:13] Yeah, I actually believe to like there's different levels of soul mates based upon like how much work you do on yourself.

[01:11:20] Oh definitely that is resonating holy moly yeah crystal was my twin flame and I really crave that bond a lot because that's one thing that it's energy based and if you if you have people listening now and they don't know what I'm talking about or if you have those are

[01:11:38] like oh yeah I know what he's talking about look good you know where I'm going with this. Energy based connections are so rare because it's a wavelength feel like you can walk into a room and people will stare at you and then they'll look away.

[01:11:56] And then there's that one person or few people that keeps their early okay. And then there's the times where you're just somewhere and talk to somebody and you hit it off and keep hitting it off and it's like iron hitting iron.

[01:12:14] You keep sharpening the blade and it keeps it that ting ting ting and you put it in the water it fizzes and you hope you meet them again.

[01:12:26] And then you meet up again and it's ting ting ting ting and the irons get sharper and it's becoming more fine. I'm like what drink is that. Yeah I was about to say.

[01:12:39] No no drinks it's just I'm using a sword sword making as a metaphor because I love swords.

[01:12:45] And you get to the point where it's like you meet up and it's just bang bang and the sword is so much stronger between you and going to J. Michael Strasinski with his foot understanding as a three three. Those who don't know.

[01:13:05] Yeah, you your truth their truth and the truth.