Star Trek Videogames Retrospect (with Tim Smith)

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[00:01:08] Welcome all. So once again, we decided to beam up a special visitor, this photographer himself, Tim Smith. Hi everybody. We were talking on the interwebs and the next thing you know, it's like, we got to get your take on the whole track. We've got to do it. We've got to do it. For a while, we were wanting to talk about the video games and I could never get anyone to commit, but he bestowed this honor. He said, I'll beat the red shirts to it. I can do this one. Absolutely. Absolutely.

[00:01:38] You got some wonderful nature photography. I'd love to let you promote your platform for a bit. Just how did you become a big sci-fi movie geek? Oh yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah. So I have my track Instagram handle at T Smitty, T Smitty Treks, which is a lot of fun. And, you know, I think like a lot of kids and a lot of people my age, like it started with like their dad or their uncle. And so like, yeah.

[00:02:07] Right. And so I think I just remember like my dad sort of like, and my uncle too, like watching track as like a kid and, you know, just sort of sticking with it. Right. And it's just sort of as, you know, it was just kind of fun and something different. And I think, you know, for a lot of people, I think it like probably spoke to them. Right. About just sort of like maybe a future, how they want a thing, you know, or, you know, equality or just basic human decency. Right. And so I think that sort of spoke to me and I think it spoke to a lot of other people as well.

[00:02:37] So it's just, it was for the lazy crowd, they love the escapism, but for those actually paying attention, we actually just dug the optimism. Yeah. Treating everyone with discretion instead of, you know, we will conquer you even in the future. It's like, no, let's be the bigger man. Right. And I think you've probably seen that quote, you know, like that guy, you know, why Star Trek?

[00:03:04] And it's like, for all those reasons, right? Like, it's the only one that really gave hope. Like everything else was, you know, all the sci-fi out there was very, you know, as much as it is now. Very grim. End of the world. You know, there's no, there's no, why are we hoping for a future? You know, like, what am I living for? Right. Like, you know, Star Trek sort of gives you that, right? You're like, oh, we're going to figure this shit out. Like it'll actually, you know, it's going to be sort of rocky for a minute, but I think we're going to figure it out, guys. Let's just stick with it. Absolutely.

[00:03:33] Absolutely. And I mean, I look at it like we look at any other genre movie, like Indiana Jones makes archaeology sexy. Yeah. Dangerous assignments. The Terminator starts off as a supernatural slasher and then turns into a, you know, I'm an enemy from a future with the unlikely hero also from the future, you know, and let's make time travel not complicated. Let's make it optimistic.

[00:04:01] It's like the only way this ends well is if you get to the end, you know, and find data that will stop the world from ending. And it seems like when people tell me a movie is derivative, I always try to ask them, OK, well, what exact, you know, material did you think it was inspired by? Right. That's just it. Let's have that conversation instead of, you know, pigeonholing a movie.

[00:04:25] Did it do its job, but it just felt too over familiar or did it just flat out just steal? Like no originators. Right. Exactly. Exactly. You know, and with this sort of this, you know, AI certainly helped a lot with the sort of, you know, Star Trek, you know, Instagram account thing. Right. Yeah. Like and, you know, like part of it, like I tried to stay sort of true to like the original.

[00:04:53] Right. You know. And for me, like there was like there was kind of like a cut up. Right. So, you know, I'm happy to do like founding of the Federation until like 2299. Right. So maybe just shortly after movie six. Right. The the undiscovered country. So I kind of wanted to stop there. Right. And try to keep it sort of as as close to sort of how it looks there. Right. But as we all know, Star Trek has one a uniform problem.

[00:05:19] Right. Like there's, you know, so I didn't really have to worry about like being consistent with uniforms, but it's kind of all over the map. And then, you know, it's like, you know, it's like Discovery came out and Stranger Things come out. Like it's sort of. We I think I don't say like it reinvents, that's not the right word, but it just sort of takes a fresh look or a different look on how those things could have been if they were produced at that time. And so I think some of the work that like I've been doing, sort of taken that it's evolved.

[00:05:48] Right. Like it just sort of taken that, taken that, taken that path. Right. And some of the images are sometimes a little more cinematic. And then sometimes I think they're a little they're a little corny and cheesy, like 60s Trek, because, you know, it should be right. And that really is like the foundation for all of it. So I think we should definitely respect our fathers, you know.

[00:06:13] It is wild, though, to how when you get into the dilemma of talking about something that has imperfections. I mean, I've had to even do this with other space operas like, you know, like Babylon five. And it's just like, OK, guys, like people dug the story. But let's be honest, every once in a while, you're going to have a ending that's a little too neat or a guest character that was played by a really hammy actor. You know, it's just right. Nothing is fell proof.

[00:06:43] You know, I mean, come on. No one thought the new Battlestar Galactica was going to work because it was based on a Colt 70s show. You know what? I loved that one as a kid. Right. Like, you know, I think we all did. Like, I love that one. It was fun. It was Star Wars on your small screen. But it's just funny how. I don't know. I think I don't know how much of it is people look at the marketing and judge the book by its cover versus they saw it and they were in the wrong mindset. I don't. Yeah. But, you know, you're right. You're absolutely right.

[00:07:13] I mean, for, you know, Battlestar Galactica and whenever it was 2014 or whatever to be such a huge hit as it was to sort of come off of what was considered a cheesy children's show in the 70s is pretty incredible. Right. And like on that Battlestar Galactica, like incredible, incredible stories, incredible acting, really thought provoking sci-fi, which is what sci-fi is supposed to be. Right. Like, yeah. Yeah.

[00:07:43] And it it sneaks in on you. Right. And it's like, you know, a couple of days later, you're like, damn, Starbuck was right about that. You know, whatever it was. Right. And, you know, it's like that's good writing. That's good television. That's good sci-fi. You know, that's that's good entertainment. That's and I mean, the Emmys understood it and no one would have guessed that they just thought it was going to be just a blockbuster TV show. And it's like, nope, went to more than just the effects. People were paying attention and dialed in. Yeah.

[00:08:13] Yeah. There was really good acting on that show. In fact, my dad wasn't necessarily a fan of it, but he watched it and he's like, that's well made. You're like, and so he would get so when you can get someone I had sci-fi remnant on there on here to talk about it. And they talked about how, you know, that was not there going to be their cup of tea, but they saw it. They're like, you know, I got nothing. It's a good show.

[00:08:37] It's just funny how you got some there are ways to take people out of their comfort zone and show them something that otherwise might not be in their field of preference. And it's even funnier how I try to see I see other people trying to avoid and be like, I would never get into Star Trek. But, you know, sooner or later, you know, I had a friend who was a big into anime and everything, and he loves Discovery.

[00:09:05] It got him into the franchise even more to where he's like, you know what? I'm going to go and reevaluate this whole thing. You know, I only saw a lot of TNG and DS9, the movies, and I've seen other people who like the newer movies. So, you know, there you go. It's whatever your generation of the 18 or Mission Impossible, you know, welcome aboard. You've got some version of it. Yeah, absolutely. The Equalizer. Come on. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:09:32] And, you know, to your point of being like well-made, my husband loves like the Downton Abbey series. He loves all of that sort of historical drama stuff. Great period drama. And, you know, not my jam, but like, you know, I sort of walked in the room and I was like, the sets, the thing, the people, the acting, the whole, I was like well-made. You know what I mean? Yeah, I'm not a period drama guy either. Yeah. I don't find myself getting into it. I'm like, okay, there's just something objectively, this is more than just how well I feel well-made it is.

[00:10:01] Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And, you know, DS9 for me is one, like, I had to go back, you know, I've gone back and kind of re-evaluated, right? Like, it wasn't my favorite one at the time, you know? And, you know, I think I've gone back recently and been like, actually, they were ahead of the curve on a lot of stuff. Yeah. I mean, this is why we have genres.

[00:10:30] They bring us out of our comfort zone. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. It's a great show. It's an absolutely great show. And, I mean, the fact that you can remember so many of the characters and you geek out whenever you see the actors and other stuff, that's... Yeah, man. I sold a second movie on an airplane last time I was on one, and I was just like...

[00:10:57] And I was just like, man, for a two-hour movie, time flew. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think it was on, like, maybe a cross-country or an international one, and they had a discovery, like, I think maybe season two. And it was like, yeah, I'm down for a re-watch. Like, let's put it in and go. Let's do this. Yeah, yeah. And that's the one where Pike shows up, of course. And, like, they were just fine. You know what I mean? Like, just a good, you know, that was probably one of the quickest flights I've ever gone on.

[00:11:27] So, really good stuff. Lovely. Lovely. So, were you always a bit of a gamer, or was it somebody that cut your eye later? No. So, I think in, like, the... It had been, like, the late 90s. I think when, like, PlayStation came out. So, we did, like, Gran Turismo, the original Mortal Kombat, the Final Fantasy, like, the first Final Fantasy.

[00:11:58] All of those great games. And we'd have people over, and, like, we would, like, you know, honestly, like, have a game party, because I don't think that's the right word. But, like, we would all, you know, play games, take turns, you know, teach each other tricks on the combo. You were actually civilized as, like, the Enterprise. You're like, okay, you go here. You're turning into the holodeck. Yeah. Yeah. And, like, we would do, like, sort of, you know, championships and that sort of thing, right? And, like, it was the 90s. There were some, you know, there were some... We were gardening, right? So, there was some, you know...

[00:12:27] So, there was just, like, a lot of, you know, it was just, like, a lot of fun, a lot of camaraderie. And then, I think we probably got, like, our first PC in, you know, around 2001. Literally the turn of the century, you know? Nice. And got... Gosh, what was that first one? I think it was Starfleet... Shit, was it Starfleet Command, I think? It was, like, role-based playing and, you know, you're doing shows. Yeah. And then, you know...

[00:12:57] I tried one of the Starfleet academies, and it actually might have been Command, where you could customize your ship and everything. And I guess I just didn't have the right graphics card or something, because I kept just goofing up. But even then, I could tell that track was always going to be around. I mean, you got freaking, you know, Sulu and Chekhov to, you know, the actors to reprise the roles.

[00:13:20] And any time I went to a local putt-putt center, they had the Voyager arcade game, and I would play the hell out of that. And you knew it was a big deal, because, like, I had only casually, like, seen parts of the show at that time. And only years later in reruns would it be, you know, on some channels, and I could set the tape. But, like, I... Track was interesting, because, like, you knew who every character was, even if you had only seen a minute of one of the other shows.

[00:13:48] They always cross-populated, but it was never in an intrusive way. You know, like, the Voyager doctor was, you know, the Hologram doctor was always showing up. Sulu was always making a cameo, or... Yes. ...was next to Ken. And, you know, don't get me started on the movies. I mean, Next Gen would always have a great episode, you know, with Scotty or Spock coming back. Right. I mean, the first episode had Bones, so it was always a collected family.

[00:14:17] And so, when I saw spinoffs, it actually got me into the constructive mode of how to do a proper, like, crossover episode instead of... Yeah. ...just the most random show that's on the same, you know, programming block. You know, like, let's do one that actually would be at home. And since these are made, they're in the same universe, they're by the same people, you know, like, let's have these captains all pass the torch to each other

[00:14:44] instead of just an okay speech, well-performed. It's like, let's give them a badass speech that they will... Right. ...that you can quote verbatim. It's very well done. I mean... And so, yeah, with games, I was just like... Even if I didn't have the right gaming card for it, like, I just always knew that it was going to pop up somewhere and adults were going to introduce it to their kids.

[00:15:08] And I did plenty of computer games because when I was briefly homeschooled, you know, I just... I needed some teaching game to do, whether it was learn how to type better while a singing robot is in the background. So, track was always interesting seeing them when they introduced the whole concept of a holodeck on the show. I was like, yeah, I wonder what actual games they play in the future besides recreating a tennis ring or dancing.

[00:15:34] And there were some stinkers, but, I mean, there was a Generations game that I remember everyone was half and half on, but I remember there was a prequel to the Insurrection movie, and that was one where everybody was kind of geeking out because it was both, like, a prequel showing you how the bad guys got started on the planet and had some other fun adventure. And I think you could play as Picard or Data, but I know Deep Space Nine.

[00:16:03] Deep Space Nine. Oh, okay, perfect. Deep Space Nine and The Fallen was a big one. It got an M rating because it was a little violent, but it was basically a Klingon under siege kind of thing. And then there was the Klingon Academy, which I did see the cinematics for. I'm like, man, those actors are having a blast. I played Klingon Academy, and I have to tell you, it was a blast. Like, it was just fun. And then, like, it's very Klingon. Do you know what I mean? Like, it's over the top. It got an M rating. It's high drama. You know what I mean?

[00:16:33] No one complained. And, like, it's good. And, like, Christopher Plummer reprised, like, you know, his role. Yes, he did. Like, I think. Yeah, and, like, he's a big actor. Like, that's a big coup. Like, I think that sort of speaks to, you know, at the time of, and still now, like, how serious it is and sort of, like, the importance of track and the sort of the royalty to it, the prestige of being in a good track. And the 90s were that weird time.

[00:17:03] Like, now everyone geeks out because they've done Avatar or Lord of the Rings type, you know, technology where they do the motion capture and everything. So just about everybody's done a Call of Duty or Cyberpunk 2077 type game. Like, but 90s was definitely a big deal because, you know, I would play all kinds of tie-in stuff like Bill Nye and the Science Guy game or SpongeBob game. And there was a great Toy Story activity center one.

[00:17:30] And even if people want to mock it now that it was kind of a cinematic thing that was on a time delay and that would repeat, there were still some many just gripping, like, detective games and gothic mystery and all kinds of other stuff that would occasionally have a very popular, you know, just actors.

[00:17:56] Like, even character people, you know, like Christopher Walken and Michael York. And so it's like many of them who popped up in all kinds of things would show up. But now, like, it's really cool to be in a video game. Like, people will know you're in it, whether it's a Super Bowl ad or you're on the cover of it. Yeah, no, absolutely right.

[00:18:20] Like, it's almost like how actors, like, maybe used to scoff at TV, you know, when it first came out. And I think they used to scoff like this. And now there's real. What's that? Yeah, yeah. And now there's, like, a prestige to that because, like, it's reaching millions of people, not only, like, physically buying the thing, but they're also, you know, have a subscription online or, you know, playing whatever the updates are, right?

[00:18:43] So, and I think it's even the same with Star Trek Online, the way they brought in so many actors from all across the series. People like to look at the bad. All across the time. Evolution. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's always easy to, like, look at all the stuff that's horrible. Like, you know, you always, that's easy. Do you know what I mean? I remember when Yahoo was a fun email to be on versus when it became kind of a clickbait site. I remember the internet when it was fun to be on. You know what I mean?

[00:19:13] Absolutely. Chat rooms, GeoCities. It was fun. Oh, my God. And it was the Wild West, dude. Like, it was the Wild West. Like, there were no, like, you just see me think about virus protection or which website you're going to, you know? And you had, like, dial-up and you spend, like, all night illegally downloading a song from, like, Napster or LimeWire. Like, it was just wild. It was so wild. Absolutely.

[00:19:41] There was one company that basically did a, in the very, very early 90s, they did, like, both an activity pack center for the original Star Trek, and then they followed it up with a next-gen, like, activity thing.

[00:19:58] And it was basically, both those games kind of had just the basic mechanics, like, all the casts doing voiceovers with simple animatics, and then it, you basically did, like, the basic functions, like, learn how to use the engineering room, learn how to teleport to a planet and find something within a way team.

[00:20:16] It was interesting how they were doing this, like, in the early days of CD-ROMs, but then gave you the basic pleasure of reenacting that for your own lonesome self instead of have to see it demonstrated on the small screen. So, it is interesting how Trek has been, I mean, now that we have, you know, iPads and we're seeing technology like that and in movies like Minority Report, it is just so funny how

[00:20:45] every tech person wanted to try out a Star Trek equivalent of that, whether it was, you know, make their own web series fan film or, yeah, and with the games, I just find, I think it's an honor that they tried all kinds of games, you know, before they went to the online, which was like an RPG equivalent, you know, for the Star Wars crowd, and it's, and I, I know the 2013,

[00:21:14] game that was based off the End of Darkness one got critically derided, but from what I saw of it, the gameplay looked kind of fun. I think it was just, I don't know, it's like people didn't like it because the story was uninspired, but truth be told, it was based off a popcorn movie that was kind of mindless fun.

[00:21:36] So, I think, I would, I thought it was just fun that people had a more modern day game where they could play as Spock or Kirk, you know, but what do I know? Right, right. Right. I totally agree with you. And I wish there were more like that for like iPad. Like, I don't always think like, you know, let me go download that for my laptop or let me go buy that CD. Like, I kind of wished I would or would, but just the convenience of being on the iPad is so easy.

[00:22:04] And there are a couple that are on the iPad, but I just think they suck. You know what I mean? Like, they're just, they're just not good. They're just not the gameplay that I want. Let me put it that way. Yeah. They're just not the gameplay that I want. Let me put it that way. There was one for the PSP that I wanted to play where you could choose your captain and just commander their ship. That was called, what was that game?

[00:22:34] Tactical Assault. Yep. That was it. And that came out in 06. I remember seeing the G4 TV review of that and it got an okay rating. I'm like, this, are you kidding? This is finally giving you what you wanted to do all this time where you can send out a repair team. You can lead a fleet into battle. This is definitely what you need. I mean, so now that they have the actual, you know, that was Tactical Assault.

[00:23:00] But now that they got the actual like fleet command desktop game out and, you know, once every other ad I saw for that on Insta, I was like, I'm in. I need to make time. Yeah, I'm in. I'm 100% in. I haven't gamed in forever, but I need to make time for this. I mean, you get to customize all your different kinds of characters. There's a huge array. You can even, it doesn't have to be their ship. You can customize your own ship. I get obsessed. You know what I mean?

[00:23:28] Like when I get like a new game like that, like it's all I can think about for like weeks. I'm playing it all the time. I've completely abandoned every responsibility I have as an adult. Right. And, you know, I'm like an eight-year-old kid on the couch with that game controller. And I'm, you know, I'm done. I'm back there. And, you know, frantically searching, you know, online for how do I beat this boss or how do I get through this, you know, whatever it is. Right. So, no, there's a lot of fun. There's a lot of exhilaration in that.

[00:23:57] There's a lot of just like pure, there's sort of joy, you know, that just comes from that. And you kind of really lose yourself. You know, there's no, you're not thinking about anything else. You're just trying to beat the Klingons, you know, whatever it is. Yes. We'll return after these messages. If you like small town mystery, crazy news, and wild history, then the Florida Men on Florida Man podcast is for you.

[00:24:24] Each week, Josh Mills and Wayne McCarty bring you the absolute best Florida has to offer. So if you're looking for a show that's safe for the family, but funny enough to help you escape everyday life, then listen to the Florida Men on Florida Man podcast. That's Florida Men, plural, on Florida Man podcast. Hey, it's Brent Pope, the host of Breakfast with Brent Pope. You've seen me on some of your favorite TV shows saying things like, give it up, Jimmy, you got to sink this putt to win. On Breakfast with Brent Pope, I sit down with guests from the entertainment world,

[00:24:54] and we do it all over breakfast. Or should I say Brent-fist? Every week on Brent-fist, you get inside Hollywood info and tips, great breakfast wrecks and booty debates. Most of all, you get the most delightful 30 minutes of your week. So dig in, it's Brent-fist time. Listen at Brent-fist.com, Apple Podcasts, or wherever fine podcasts are found. I can only hope they do more and more of my dude instead of... Me too. ...leave it here. Yeah, me too. And I definitely like more, you know, me personally, like, I want to be in a ship.

[00:25:22] Like, I don't mind, like, an away mission or two, but I don't really like, like, half and half. You know what I mean? Like... You need a full glass on this one. Yeah, like, I just want to be in the ship and blow stuff up. You know what I mean? Like, that's really... That's what I want to do. Oh, hell. Or even give us just fun tasks, like... Mm-hmm. ...how do we repair the station? You can do different actions, and there's different consequences. There needs to be some other kind of free-roaming game,

[00:25:49] but with some loose interaction still, and... I... Yes, I totally agree with you. The thing that frustrates me the most about, like, Star Trek Online and, like, the, like, you know, ground missions or away missions is, like, there's just this incessant hours and hours of running around looking for shit. You know what I mean? And I'm just running around and running around, and then, like, if I don't know how to interact with it, nothing happens.

[00:26:17] If I interact with it the wrong way, the thing, you know, and it's just annoying. Do you know what I mean? I mean, like, you know, I don't mind doing it, but it shouldn't be so... It just seems like I'm natting, I'm swatting gnats, you know what I mean? And I'm not really getting anything, you know? And so, like, cut that in half, you know what I mean? Like, cut it in half, make it more concise. Like you said, like, let me be doing something besides running around and jumping over rocks and having the digital dudes all splicing into me because we're all in a corner, you know?

[00:26:47] Like, yeah, let me do something cool. Let me do something cool down there. Mm-hmm. Hell, let us create... Liberate the city. I don't know. Liberate the city. Let us take over Romulus. Hell, let us take... Something. Build a few other stations by Deep Space Nine. Yes. Let Kai Wen come back from hell. Do you know what I mean? Like, it'd be something fun, you know?

[00:27:12] We'll do an alternate universe where Voyager only lasts a one-year away mission, and we... Right. Bring them back. Right. Earlier, yeah. How... Do you... Did you like Voyager? Yeah, no. Give it to me. I like all the show, but... Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Chakonte would be fun if you could learn more about his unusual ancestry. Like, just... Yeah. But I just love doing alternate timelines and other stuff. No, I do too.

[00:27:42] It's totally fun. And that's kind of why a little bit, like, I sort of, like, my Instagram page, like, it's sort of a... It's, you know, it's definitely... One time, one... Okay, I'm going to say this about the fandom. They sometimes, like, take the shit, like, real serious. Do you know what I mean? Like, I had, like, one dude, like, getting onto me, like, he was like, you couldn't have this technology because it didn't exist until this year.

[00:28:08] And then another thing, he was like, Starfleet engineers do not know how to load bear this type of stuff. And I was like, bro, first of all, you know, like, literally none of it's real. Like, it's all fiction. You know what I mean? Literally. And I love it. Listen, I love it, buddy, too. And I get annoyed with inconsistencies, but that is just how it goes, right? And so I honestly, like, I had to kind of block him because it was just...

[00:28:35] He just kept being sort of very persistent, sort of... This very persistent nerd in a way, right? And I don't mean... This was Star Trek Online? Yeah, no, this was on my, like, Instagram account. Oh, jeez. He just kept, like... Yeah, he just kept, like, commenting over and over again about, like, how it was inaccurate or real consistencies. And I was like, dude, it's just not that deep. Like, it's something, like, I do, personally, just for me to have fun. You know what I mean? Like, it's just, you know, it's not real, dude. But settle down.

[00:29:07] There was a Star Wars game like that years ago called Galaxy of Heroes. Oh, yeah. And I played in 2017. It was that same kind of deal where you could... Or was that the one? No. Actually, yes. So, yeah, you create your own teams. You know, it doesn't matter what side they're on, just for the sake of argument. It's all the heroes and villains you like, and you can customize your attack team, and you

[00:29:35] take turns, you know, blasting other stuff on the computer. It's almost like a very intense chess game, you know? Yeah. Star Wars has some good games, I think. And I think they have some good fan films, too. Absolutely. I don't know... The acting in the fan film seems to be so much better. Like, I'll look at a Trek fan film, and I'm like, yes, good graphics. You've got a thing. This is a nice angle, whatever you're doing. And then, like, they show the people, and I'm like...

[00:30:06] Yeah. And I'm not... I know it sounds like me very, like, critical of that, and I'm not. I'm just, like, sort of, like, when I compare it to, like, sort of the Star Wars fan films, like, you know, I feel like they have, like, Oscar-nominated folks in there, and then, I don't know. There seems to be just a little difference there to me a little bit. I hope that didn't just piss everybody off, but it might have. It's your opinion. You're validated. You should... There we go. I mean, I had my share of that.

[00:30:35] There were some people who I would encounter and think they would like the fan films, and they were like, no, I don't like those at all. And so, it's interesting how I still... Even with some venomous guys on the internet, Tract is still overall kind of keen on people being the bigger man and always not overstaying their welcome. It's like, just have your opinion. Oh, 100%. Yeah. And I never, like, leave comments on people's shit, right? Because, like, that's just being... Like, I'm not being, like, mean. You know what I mean?

[00:31:04] I'm like, okay, I give it to Tract. It's just not my jam. I, you know, I'm going to watch something else now, right? Like, but never be, like, intentionally mean to someone. Someone is like... It's like a craft and something, like, they've created. And it's really something personal that they've given as well. You know, like, no, that's just not cool. Axanar is good. Have you seen Axanar on YouTube? Yes. Yeah, that one's good. I'm ready. That'll be nice when that's sort of finished up, I hope, pretty soon. That one's been a lot of fun.

[00:31:32] And Trek guys, for the most part, you know, I've had all kinds of people with different kinds of perceptions. And for the most part, they're pretty good at just saying, that's my take on it. Let's, you know, move on instead of just... Yeah. Let's just demolish something or praise the hell out of it to where there's nothing left to talk about. Yeah, absolutely right. Absolutely right. And I think everybody's just...

[00:32:00] That's why there's so many throwback, even, you know, podcasts now I see where it's like, okay, if we can't... I think everybody learned after a while they couldn't keep up with stuff. And instead of just getting wigged out or annoyed by some of the oversaturated stuff, let's just go back and talk about some lesser known stuff. Absolutely. Do you remember this 90s cartoon that Nickelodeon doesn't air anymore? Do you remember this music band that was a one-hit wonder, but anytime they're at a dance club, everybody goes, oh, I love that song.

[00:32:29] Whatever happened to them? You know, just with the success of HBO's new documentary, Yacht Rock, I think a lot of people are just realizing, go back into the well. And instead of, you know, instead of just looking at a hackneyed, you know, clickbait article, instead of looking at something that's going to just be divisive, it's just go back into your closet, find something that you grew up on, and then see why you've kept it all these years.

[00:32:57] I think a lot of people have to be reminded about what they value. And, you know, much like the whole track rhetoric is this, but it's just also, I mean, I, in recent years, I never thought I would get therapy, but sure enough, I got it. And I was like, man, just when you think, you know, everything about yourself, you know, obviously we don't know everything, you know, in life, otherwise it'd be a piece of cake.

[00:33:26] But I found out something about myself I thought I had put behind me. So I think that's the other thing. Like you're, when you're just having to learn and grow and you have entertainment that reinforces a positive value like that, that's why it's got an everlasting appeal to it. You know, that's why it took CBS a while to kind of realize, oh, track is still our baby. It's not just, you know, whatever. You know what I did?

[00:33:54] I just finished three years of therapy about three or four weeks ago. And I'm with you. Hey. Like it really, you know, just to your point further, like really opened my eyes up about You don't need to do a line though. You know what I mean? So yeah. So I, I'm for it. Like, don't be afraid to do it. Go do it. If you're even hesitating to do it, go do it. If you meet someone who isn't paying attention or not doing it for you, pick a different one instead of just I'm beyond helping.

[00:34:24] No, no, no one is beyond being helped. No, no. Exactly right. You just have to find the right person. You just have to find the right person. And the right person's out there. I totally agree with that. Yeah. It was, and the shit is hard, right? Like there are some parts where I was like, oh, never doing this again. Or like, I would be so honestly just like pissed off at the therapist. Do you know what I mean? I would just be like, you know, like I'd come in there, like my arms would be crossed. I'd be like, what? No. You know what I mean? Are those questions they'd be like, so how does that make you feel?

[00:34:54] And one time, like, I just got so mad. I said, I feel like you already know what the answer is. Will you just tell it to me just this one time so I don't have to like do the whole thing, you know? So it's a thing, you know, it's a, it's definitely a process. Totally a process, dude. I, I mean, I found out stuff that was eating me up that I thought I had put behind me years ago. And it's like, well, yeah, it's not so much that it didn't bother you, but because you never actually talked about it with someone,

[00:35:23] it's still kind of ate at you indirectly. And it's funny is it's like, again, we always think there's a this or that. There's always an in-between. There's always for better or worse where you're just like, and with the track games, they definitely kind of got to that point where it's like, here's an alternative. Obviously, you know, Star Wars, you know, takes names and all the.

[00:35:50] You know, I would argue that I used to think that Star Trek always had a lot of boring books, but they've gotten better in that category over the years. I always thought they only had kind of just comics and nothing much else, but they're slowly everybody's rediscovering a bit of everything. And obviously for those who've gone, gone digital, not all of them are going to be on Steam. Right. Right. And the comic books are rad. Comic books are good.

[00:36:20] They are really upping the game and there's something for everybody. And I'm going to definitely review some more of those books and comics tie-ins because they, it's kind of a challenge. It's getting me to want to get back into reading more often, but it's also, it's a fun game. Like with any tie-in media is like, will this entertain, you know, casual fans,

[00:36:46] any kind of sci-fi fan or only just, you know, track diehards. It's always fun just seeing how people use the license and having been honored to even interview some of the authors like James Swallows, you know, it's fun hearing him and the likes of David Pack and others hype in on the whole is just like, we want to, you know, this is when we became comfortable doing our own thing versus, you know, pressures on. We're now going to make a tie-in book.

[00:37:16] And I think you could say the same for games, depending on the budget, depending on the motivation determined how creative and endeavor it was going to be. And with this full fleet command, I think that's exactly where track needs to be right now. Just have a fun console game that you can do casually. And then go back to re-watching the movies and shows for the time.

[00:37:41] I take it you have your master list of like episodes you'll revisit and track episodes you'll skip or you'll watch, but you're not entertained by it. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. And even like, I'll go back like to different series as well. You know, like a few months ago, like I started season one episode of one Enterprise and we went right through the whole thing. Right. And it was not, it's good. Right.

[00:38:11] Like, and I've done it a couple of times with Enterprise. I mean, you know what? Cold classic, 100% get it. Like, I understand why we were like kind of burnt out on it at the time and why it sort of felt like it didn't live up to whatever our supposed track expectations were. It was definitely one of those. It like, I think the timing was bad because I remember growing up watching it and being like, if this wasn't track related, I would, you know, I would change the channel. This sucks. 100%.

[00:38:39] So then I come back to it years later in the late 2010s and I'm like, there's some good. Okay. There's not there yet. Oh, season three and four. Okay. You know. Yeah. Some shows you do have to wait for them to really get good, unfortunately. But honestly, like TMG was like that. They're the first ones to admit season three is when we really started, you know, picking off with them. And season one of the season. We just didn't always know it because it was syndicated. So we didn't always watch it in order. Exactly right. Right.

[00:39:09] Exactly right. And, you know, what I kind of like about season one and season two is like, I think they're very Star Trek, the original series. You know, there's some camp and some corniness and some overacting. And there's even a lot of the same like cinematography and the same kind of shots. So it's almost like the same director and the same cameraman did, you know, the original series with Shatner. And then he showed up and did this with Picard and Riker 2, you know, which I like, right? But then like it became its own thing.

[00:39:39] And it's all slowly get your baby steps in. Yeah. Like any, you know, like anything, like I'm sure like your podcast, right? Or like my photography, like it didn't. It did not start out well. In the filmmaking, there are several times where you're like, I need to hang it up. And then you're like, no, no, no, stop. Yeah. You're getting way too caught up in this. I'm overthinking it. I'm stuck in my head over what is really essentially you're making art, right?

[00:40:08] Or it's fiction, which is really like all of life. It's just fiction. You're making it up. There's no rules. Do what you want to do. And do what you want to do. Do what you want to do. Or to quote Dan Lizzie, do anything you want to do. Amen. Exactly right. Do anything you want to do. I think we get so stuck on these sort of like old fashioned Puritan. Yes.

[00:40:37] Puritanical ideas that just don't really hold water for people or how life is for us today. You know what I mean? Like things have changed since 1793, guys. You know what I mean? Like it's, it's kind of different 300 years later. Surprise. Right. No kidding.

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