Interview with Metroplex Atheist non-profit organization President Umair Khan & Social Media Director Julie Weston

[00:00:06] It's a JackedUpReviewShow

[00:00:46] I'm your host, Soli.

[00:00:47] And once again, we go into a variety of social and political topics.

[00:00:51] Here from the Metroplex Atheist Nonprofit Organization, we got Umar Khan, the president of

[00:00:59] said organization. Welcome. Hi, I can't hear you. I cannot complain. And Julie Weston, social media

[00:01:06] director. Don't make me more fancy than I am. I tried to give everyone a voice. So I had seen,

[00:01:13] again, the various billboards for you guys and read up on you guys. And I was like, see,

[00:01:18] this is a pretty cool organization. It's been around since the 80s and it's

[00:01:23] talked about the In No God We Trust campaign and just how to just, again, keep religion separate

[00:01:34] from the state, you know? And we'll let you guys talk into more on the history of it,

[00:01:42] how it got founded and just future aspirations. But I love it, just the whole, hey, don't be a puppet

[00:01:51] message. Yeah. Julie, why don't you go ahead and talk about the history? And then I will talk

[00:01:58] about the lawsuit. How does that sound? You all explain the difference between the two campaigns

[00:02:05] and the lawsuit and all that. So the history of Metruplex Atheists started, so you may or may not

[00:02:12] be familiar with Maureen Maudio-Hare. She is the woman who started the American Atheists in 1963.

[00:02:22] So the American Atheist has been an organization now for 60 years. And the Metruplex Atheist

[00:02:30] started as a sister chapter here in the DFW area of the American Atheists back in 1991.

[00:02:39] Okay, nice. And then we became our own entity as a nonprofit in around 2000.

[00:02:50] We as an organization have been meeting every Wednesday night at J. Gilligan's Bar and Grill

[00:02:54] in Arlington for the last 22 years now. Nice. I've been there before. It's a lovely place.

[00:03:02] Yeah, so we're there every Wednesday night from 6.30 to 8.30. That's kind of our anchor event.

[00:03:08] It's where a lot of our new members find us. All of our events can always be found on the

[00:03:13] meetup page. I guess I could have left that for the end, but there you have it.

[00:03:18] And what we're talking about today and the billboard and why you reached out to us,

[00:03:23] I'll give an oversight and then I'm going to let Amir talk about the,

[00:03:27] because I was around for the In No God We Trust, which you mentioned, but that was not our campaign

[00:03:32] this time. So the In No God We Trust banner campaign happened back in 2019. We,

[00:03:41] to be held with an educational seminar following shortly after the banners came down.

[00:03:46] So fast forward to 2023 and we applied for a banner campaign for keeping God out of our public

[00:03:55] schools, the separation of church and state. And that mission of Metroplex Atheists is we fight

[00:04:02] to promote the separation of church and states. That is our primary goal. We all, we market

[00:04:10] ourselves as, because we're one of many atheist organizations in the DFW

[00:04:18] Metroplex and free-thinking organizations. And the campaign that we did this time was keeping God

[00:04:25] out of our schools. And the city of Fort Worth did not take kindly to our message. And so

[00:04:34] we originally were approved for our banners to go up in the city of Fort Worth. And that

[00:04:40] was in what November of 2022. And then in May of this year, they said, we're sorry, we're not going

[00:04:47] to let you hang your banners. And so we had to pivot and discuss our next course of action.

[00:04:58] And I'm going to hand it over to Amir and let him discuss what then transpired

[00:05:06] because he was more at the forefront of that than I was. I mean, I was in it, but he was,

[00:05:12] he was more in it than I was. That's fine. We'd like to give all kinds of progressive

[00:05:17] causes of voice here on the show. Thank you. Thank you, Julie. That really does cover

[00:05:22] our history and the general points of where we started and where we are now.

[00:05:28] In terms of the lawsuit, really it began that we had a banner campaign.

[00:05:33] And the banners are these banners that stand in downtown Fort Worth area, specifically in this case.

[00:05:41] And you will see two banners on these polls that are about, I think, five feet more or less that

[00:05:51] you can put up like UNT does one and certain TCU University does one. And our goal was to

[00:05:58] set up a banner for us. We were going to do a public educational seminar

[00:06:03] for Indo God, the banner set in Keep God Out of Our School this time. And it's really simply

[00:06:10] the banner was the goal to kind of put that in a very public space and of course a lecture

[00:06:15] to speak on the conversation. Well, the banners, I need to, I'm going to interject here for a

[00:06:22] moment. The banners were to promote the educational seminar at the end of August.

[00:06:29] And then the city said, you're not going to hang your banners. Well, and that led to our

[00:06:35] the, to have the banners you are required to have a seminar of sort. It's one of the

[00:06:44] requirements to be able to put up in their policies. Along with that, like we of course,

[00:06:52] we met all the criteria of the policies in 2019. And of course, they didn't notice it

[00:06:59] until after they were up and there was some ruckus but their lawyers basically said you

[00:07:05] have to let them do it. In fact, there's a quote from the former mayor saying, well, you know,

[00:07:12] we may not like it, but they can do it. In this case, this time they one of the assistant

[00:07:21] city councilmen, if I'm not mistaken, it was the assistant city manager,

[00:07:27] assistant city manager who denied it before it was approved even though we met all the

[00:07:33] criteria's and the reasoning he gave us was predominantly something like we did not meet

[00:07:39] a certain level of historical importance or magnitude of size, like, you know, a football

[00:07:46] game or something of that nature, which are not in the rules at all. So in a sense, this is

[00:07:52] something they were used for and they simply made that case on our basis. So then we reached

[00:08:04] out to a few organizations, FFRF and of course American Atheists, which are the big ones that

[00:08:08] do legal cases and American Atheists are supporting us on this. They have been leading the lawsuit

[00:08:15] against the city of Fort Worth on that. And of course, since lawsuits take time and we were

[00:08:24] not able to get the banners up, which was our initial thing that we wanted to put the banners

[00:08:28] up, we saw the billboard that you mentioned earlier that we decided since we can't have

[00:08:35] that and we do want to promote our lecture that we're going to be having at the end of August,

[00:08:39] August 26th. We had that billboard and of course the lawsuit has been ongoing. At this time, there's

[00:08:48] not much to say except that we did get a judge that is known to be conservative in his rulings

[00:08:56] and the American Atheist legal team who are amazing and they've been really supportive

[00:09:03] are working at what we can do to challenge what really is a question of freedom of speech

[00:09:13] and this really overreach of power of government employees who are more concerned about enforcing

[00:09:23] their ideals rather than democratic freedoms. I've noticed that quite a lot where it seems like

[00:09:31] they'll, especially if you want permission to use a location, you can pay the fee and do the paperwork

[00:09:37] and they can still say no we don't want you setting up shop here. So let me just interject

[00:09:44] here for a moment if I may. Yes. So when the InnoGod Trust campaign back in 2019,

[00:09:52] we ticked all the boxes. They allowed us to hang our signs. There were vandalizations.

[00:09:58] It is important to note that the mayor at the time was Ms. Betsy Price.

[00:10:04] Since 2019, there has been an election Betsy stepped down as mayor

[00:10:09] and a more conservative mayor. Betsy was a conservative mayor but as Umiere pointed out,

[00:10:16] her comment at the time was we may not agree with her message but everybody has a right to

[00:10:20] freedom of speech. So she didn't agree with our message even as mayor but she agreed that we had

[00:10:27] a right to share whatever that message was and because we ticked all the boxes and because we

[00:10:33] had the educational seminar within the five-day window that they required, there was nothing

[00:10:38] anybody in the city at that point could do because the signs had already gone up and what

[00:10:43] Umiere may or may not have made very clear because I was a little confused and I was even a

[00:10:48] part of this was that when in May the city of Fort Worth, the assistant city manager and the city

[00:10:56] council came together and said well we're not going to allow you to have that freedom of speech

[00:11:02] this time. So that was when we decided as an organization the board came together and said

[00:11:09] these are our options. We can fight for the injunction

[00:11:13] and we got denied the injunction because as Umiere did point out, we drew an extremely

[00:11:22] notoriously conservative judge by the name of Judge O'Connor. So we went ahead and did the billboard

[00:11:31] which is what you saw which led to this interview. We had our educational seminar at the end of

[00:11:38] August by all accounts. It was a successful seminar. We had several different people come in.

[00:11:45] We had Bradley Onishi was our keynote speaker came in from San Francisco. He's an associate professor

[00:11:53] of philosophy and religious studies. We had a pastor, Katie Hayes of the Galileo church.

[00:12:00] We had Randall Theo who is the current president of the FFRF which stands for Freedom from

[00:12:06] Relention Foundation DFW chapter and we have Bill Jeutine who is the state director from Houston

[00:12:14] of the American atheist. They came and they spoke as a panel on this topic

[00:12:20] and it was a successful topic and it was a successful seminar. After the seminar

[00:12:28] we had to make a decision on what to do regarding the lawsuit and because that is it's still an

[00:12:39] active lawsuit neither one of us are really at liberty to discuss where we've gone from there.

[00:12:45] So that puts a kill on that part of the conversation which I regret at this time

[00:12:51] but we can no longer discuss what's going on with the lawsuit.

[00:12:58] We could still talk about the organization and where we hope to go from here

[00:13:02] but the lawsuit is a discussion that we cannot have without our legal representation present.

[00:13:11] Though you are more than welcome to reach out if you'd like

[00:13:14] Jeffrey T. Blackwell of the American Atheist is the lawyer that is the head of our legal team.

[00:13:25] As you pointed out, American Atheist has been instrumental and extremely supportive in our

[00:13:30] fight. The Freedom from Religion Foundation also sent a letter on our behalf to the city of

[00:13:39] Fort Worth but it was the American Atheist who actually drew and filed the lawsuit on our behalf.

[00:13:52] It's good to get clarification but have you been impressed with the members and the turnout?

[00:14:00] Well, I mean yeah, you remember what the head count was it was almost 100 people at the

[00:14:07] seminar that day deep right? Yeah, we got a lot of activity at the seminar. We've seen more people

[00:14:12] online engaging with our group interested in how they can be more active politically. It really is

[00:14:20] kind of a lighting rod for a lot of the anxieties and issues that a lot of Americans who are

[00:14:28] secular even if they have whatever faith they want that's right are feeling this kind of

[00:14:35] not just overreach but a realization that this has been here and it is really starting to affect

[00:14:41] well it's always been affecting but now they're seeing it especially online that you know a lot of

[00:14:47] people were coming up in many different ways supporting us to saying yeah they want to take

[00:14:53] some kind of action but not exactly sure what to do. Well especially being here in DFW

[00:15:00] I know Cam you're in Canada but here down in Texas. I'm here. Oh you're here in Texas okay so you know

[00:15:08] you were originally based in Canada though were you not? I was not. I have a pal who's from Canada

[00:15:14] but I've been in Texas all my life. I have a friend family in San Francisco. Okay got you.

[00:15:20] I must have you confused with somebody else then it's all good everybody starts to blend

[00:15:25] together after a while. I have a relative in Canada but I'm very disappointed. No no no it's not that

[00:15:31] it's I literally, Umiere can tell you that we have we met a lot of people who were supporting us

[00:15:38] through this who know of our organization who are not from Texas but follow me when our lawsuit

[00:15:49] was initially filed. We had people, I met from the friendly atheist in an article on us on his

[00:16:01] website. I have talked to him he's wonderful. I love him. Seth Andrews did a blurb about us on

[00:16:11] his show The Thinking Atheist. We had stories in the Fort Worth Weekly the Fort Worth Report.

[00:16:18] I did an interview with KERA that appeared on NPR radio. So there were a lot of people who don't

[00:16:26] live locally to DFW but because of these national you know I mean the friendly the friendly atheist

[00:16:34] is a national newsletter. Yeah so people heard about us who don't live here and sent us letters

[00:16:41] of support and because I am the social media director I saw most of that correspondence

[00:16:50] and responded to a lot of you know thanking people and it's refreshing because as you know

[00:16:56] living in DFW and being an atheist can be dangerous. It can also be a situation where

[00:17:04] the reason I do what I do and I think Umir and I are on the same page on this is because

[00:17:13] we are okay being out so to speak. There are a lot of people within our community

[00:17:21] that because of what they do for work or because they're not out to their families as

[00:17:26] being an atheist or a secular humanist they have to be careful about interviews or stories or

[00:17:36] even if it's in print and their faces and out there they still have to be careful.

[00:17:42] We have a few members who use pseudonyms

[00:17:48] because of what they do for work and they can't you know we have people who are educators

[00:17:53] who if it was outed that they were atheists may no longer have jobs. That's a very real threat here

[00:17:59] in Texas. I believe it. Yeah it goes back to even just it has the echoes of just you know

[00:18:09] any segregated states let alone back in the 90s when people were being accused of firing each

[00:18:15] other based on their sexual preferences and it does seem like strides of that have from

[00:18:20] especially from the outright and QAnon have been very influential in convincing

[00:18:27] members of Congress in their respective states to try and implement this kind of fascist activity

[00:18:32] where you're just like no that's a violation of our freedoms we hold dear. You can't get rid of

[00:18:38] people based on religious affiliation. Well and to keep in mind too that a lot of people

[00:18:47] like you know a lot of people in the atheist community are a lot of white men and I'm not saying

[00:18:56] that to I mean Umiir is not and obviously I am not a white male but a good portion of our community

[00:19:06] are still white men. But there is diversity within our groups there are people of different

[00:19:15] ethnic backgrounds and female. There are a lot more female and females in our organizations

[00:19:23] than I think anybody realizes though not you know if you do a cross section like when I go to

[00:19:31] Gilligan's on a Wednesday night for a meetup I'm one of usually maybe two or three women there

[00:19:37] and everybody else is male and I'm okay with that I don't have an issue with that.

[00:19:42] I'm not sure I've been a member of several different atheist organizations now for almost

[00:19:48] 10 years here in DFW and I still don't get why there are so many more men than there are women

[00:19:57] in these organizations because I've spoken to a lot of women who are atheists or agnostic or

[00:20:04] free thinkers or secular humanists who just don't feel comfortable coming to gatherings

[00:20:09] because it's so many more men. That goes back to my job I've always felt more comfortable around the

[00:20:15] male population than I have the female population in general anyway so I it's not a complex

[00:20:22] for me it's not an issue but I understand for some women why that would be that being said

[00:20:27] it doesn't really show a very big cross section of who we are and what we're about

[00:20:33] and that sometimes can be frustrating because I feel like the more women that we have the

[00:20:39] more diversity that we have and and Americans speak to this too you know there's just there's

[00:20:47] not a lot of diversity among atheist groups and because you know you have a lot of

[00:20:59] high peanut sorry my dog just came in the room she just forced herself into the bedroom

[00:21:06] you coming up come here she's concerned about the conversation

[00:21:11] she's just concerned because mama's not feeling well and she's been like clinging to me all day

[00:21:19] anyway I don't know really where I was going with that other than to say you were just doing

[00:21:25] a disclaimer just noting hey you know yeah well I feel like there were more women at this seminar

[00:21:31] than I saw back in 2019 I have seen a lot more women become actively involved with groups across the

[00:21:41] board I joined the fellowship for Freethought Dallas nine years ago and I remember Metroplex

[00:21:48] atheist now for six years and I remember when I joined both organizations other than the

[00:21:55] women of reason dinner and for the fellowship of Freethought Dallas I would go to events and I

[00:22:02] would be again literally one of a handful of women at any given event and in some sometimes I still

[00:22:13] am one of a handful of women at at events but I think part of our message with Metroplex

[00:22:21] atheist and Amir you can correct me if I'm wrong is that we want to promote anybody who wants to be

[00:22:29] involved and we don't care I personally don't care I cannot speak for the entire organization

[00:22:38] but we do aim to be all inclusive and welcoming of all groups you know um we don't care if you're

[00:22:49] black or brown or gay or straight or trans you know any part of the LGBTQ

[00:22:57] umbrella we just want people to be involved who want to fight for our rights just like anybody else

[00:23:08] and that's good I will I this is also just empowering to kind of know just remind everyone

[00:23:15] hey freedoms must be fought you know we have the constitution for a reason and to just act like

[00:23:23] they don't exist just to serve one person's agenda versus the other you know it's just

[00:23:28] it's very saddening that it keeps coming down to this and that was that was the idea behind

[00:23:34] the lawsuit um was because they're telling us you don't have a right to hang your banners

[00:23:41] but the Kenneth Copeland ministries could hang theirs or TCU was able to hang theirs

[00:23:47] promoting their ideas and their um conferences so but it wasn't good for us

[00:23:57] and that was what the whole lawsuit was about was that they were suppressing our

[00:24:00] freedom of speech which as you just pointed out is a constitutional thing it's not because

[00:24:05] we're atheists it's because you're going against the US constitution right and that's why we were

[00:24:11] like this is not acceptable by the way that was peanut hello hey puppy say hi puppy hi buddy

[00:24:24] well and what do you guys think you mess so well together other than just again being very

[00:24:31] progressive very well worded and trying to make clear your your intent to outsiders well the the

[00:24:43] group as i mean kind of like how part of what julie mentioned is that there are you know some

[00:24:48] people that are going to call themselves atheists and some not as much even if they don't have a

[00:24:52] faith you know these issues aren't specifically of just atheists which is why i hope that we can use

[00:25:00] this as an issue to talk about you know uh as the lecture was about christian nationalism's attack on

[00:25:09] public schools to focus on how this affects all of us you know this is when i'm talking about

[00:25:13] christians we're talking about a very um extreme demographic that use oftentimes dog whistle

[00:25:21] of like you know they're indoctrinating our children so we should be able to send

[00:25:25] counselors and all that stuff to texas schools you know this is something that affects all of us

[00:25:31] you know if you don't need to be an atheist or necessarily in the atheist group to feel

[00:25:36] the impact of whether or not your government has democratic infrastructure to maintain

[00:25:45] you know an accountability or not and i think when you can just decide what the rules are

[00:25:49] and the judges can basically make up whatever reason to kind of cover for you know the complete

[00:25:57] you know disavowing of democratic freedoms affects all of us and that was also something that

[00:26:04] we were hoping to achieve with having people from different backgrounds like dr reverend kati haze

[00:26:12] from the gal leo church which uh yesterday found itself you know with protesters because they were

[00:26:21] pro you know they're very pro trans group and they're trying to help and support trans people

[00:26:25] who are you know really feeling a lot of uh impact from the anti trans laws that are being

[00:26:32] passed in texas they're a progressive church they're very progressive and forward thinking

[00:26:38] and their belief so even though she is a christian and a pastor she still does not agree that anybody

[00:26:48] should be marginalized or made to feel less than because of who they are so she is she goes against

[00:26:56] the grain in that way and that's one of the reasons we love her well because it's not

[00:27:01] it's not even though it's not either or because there is a history of religious individuals going

[00:27:07] against oftentimes the mainstream dogma especially in america that the mainstream has always been

[00:27:13] commanded by christian nationals because they've always tried to hold power and there's always been

[00:27:17] that uh root but i agree with you i agree with you i was just saying that katie is one of the

[00:27:24] more recent ones yes that we know about that's fighting for those rights that's all i was getting

[00:27:32] at and she was great on our panel she was absolutely she i was blown away well and that this

[00:27:42] is cool too to know that many different groups can find common ground on hey you know we're

[00:27:50] speaking different languages and we got different you know perspectives and everything but we overall

[00:27:56] had the same goal which is you respect each other and you don't you know misinterpret

[00:28:03] the law deliberately to spread hatred and censor people you know i mean just just the two people

[00:28:11] you're speaking here to tonight i mean umir was raised muslim and i was raised jewish and episcopal

[00:28:19] we we could not come from more different backgrounds right but the fact that we agree

[00:28:25] on many different hot topic issues is what because you asked what do you think i think your question

[00:28:34] was along the lines of what brings you guys together and it's that we can put our cultural

[00:28:40] differences aside and all come together because three of the gentlemen that are on the board

[00:28:47] had been longtime members of metraplex atheists and their old school they're good old texas boys

[00:28:55] you know um and came from also religious backgrounds growing up you know who i'm talking about him here

[00:29:03] um yeah and then we have a younger member who was our secretary and he comes from

[00:29:12] an evangelical background and then our other board member is still in the closet to most of her

[00:29:21] family and her job oh wow so she yeah so we do have another female board member

[00:29:29] but she can't be as outspoken as i am it really is amazing it's 2023 and here we are still

[00:29:38] we're having um multiple reiterations of the same conversation and it seems

[00:29:45] what do you think yeah or what are some really good tips and tricks for others probably pursuing

[00:29:51] a similar charitable cause i think sorry yeah yeah i think personally uh and really what i see

[00:30:01] as politics is if you're looking for information on how to make an individual consumer choice on

[00:30:06] who you vote for it no matter how much effort you put into it it's not going to matter it's

[00:30:11] just one vote but if you are willing to build collaborative collaborative organizations

[00:30:18] and movements community building in a sense um with a lot of these demographics that are impacted by

[00:30:25] the government that texas is uh that's where you're going to find the most significance

[00:30:31] you don't have to go far it's just what district are you in what councils are there even small

[00:30:36] groups that may not seem like they're doing a lot you know we're not a huge group in terms of like

[00:30:42] hundreds right now especially after covid that a lot of people a lot pretty much all the

[00:30:46] organizations just became anemic but you know if you make an impact and you get people to show up

[00:30:51] and raise that awareness you know and of course if you make that not to say that every group needs

[00:30:57] to do what we do but that collaboration and hopefully building a voting block that can oppose

[00:31:06] um this kind of demographic of you know outrage over religious fundamentalism in a sense

[00:31:16] i mean that's going to be how you make the impact not voting as an individual but as a collective it's

[00:31:22] not about me it's about us bingo i i could i could not have said that better and i'd like to add that

[00:31:30] you know the the important thing to remember is how many people are registered to vote registered

[00:31:36] but don't actually go to the polls it's it's not a matter it's not even a matter of voting

[00:31:42] it's we have to get people to the polls to actually vote to elicit that change that umir was just

[00:31:48] discussing um and that that's a big struggle is how do you get people to vote because there are a lot

[00:31:56] of people in our community who feel like well it doesn't matter because it's a red state

[00:32:02] it's a conservative city that i you know i happen to live in dallas county which is one

[00:32:08] of the only blue counties in the entire state of texas um and even we're becoming more red again

[00:32:15] i apologize i'm sitting outside on my patio and i live right next to 75 so i apologize i

[00:32:21] seriously can't hear any noise oh that's oh that i'm glad to know because uh motorcycle just revved

[00:32:27] its engine on the highway um so it's it's not even a matter of in my opinion it's it's not

[00:32:37] there are plenty of us who are registered to vote but how many of us actually make the

[00:32:40] after-go to the polls yeah it's and the only way you exact change is by voting

[00:32:48] there is an increase i noticed in just also not only just people flaking out or saying i

[00:32:55] don't think my vote or voice matters but i notice also whenever there's an incident on tv

[00:33:01] i will continually see people who don't know the difference between a protest versus a riot

[00:33:10] yeah i think it's why do you think that is i think it's simply a lack of a political education i mean

[00:33:15] it you know if my vote doesn't matter like i said like your one vote no matter if you just throw

[00:33:21] it away or put all the effort in the world to vote for the perfect candidate

[00:33:26] it's meaningless without that group i think yeah it's like getting getting to the election

[00:33:32] is such a simple small task it only takes a couple of hours which it only should take less than that

[00:33:38] but it is really that organization in the community it is about these issues that affect people you

[00:33:44] show up in solidarity for trans people you show up for women you show up for you know even

[00:33:51] immigrants you show up for the working poor you show up and you build that community that relationship

[00:33:58] so and and the most important leadership and to say we're gonna but we're gonna promote this candidate

[00:34:05] and they have that platform that isn't owned by the politician but owned by the people in the

[00:34:10] communities like and you have to do and what everybody talks about the senator races and

[00:34:16] the governor races and you know attorney generals and all of that the thing is is that

[00:34:21] when it comes to voting in grassroots you have to start on the local level and that means your

[00:34:27] city council and your um your municipalities and a lot there are people who will vote in

[00:34:38] the general elections for the big offices like governor and representatives senators

[00:34:45] and president but they don't vote in their local elections and I have been guilty of that

[00:34:53] not anymore but I have in the past been guilty of not voting in my local election

[00:34:59] and you have to start at the local level so if you live in Dallas county and you're registered

[00:35:05] to vote in Dallas county then you need to go to the polls and be voting for your Dallas city

[00:35:12] council yeah and I would go ahead I would go as far as to say I mean even if you do all that

[00:35:22] it really just comes down to like well this person needs to vote or this person needs to vote

[00:35:26] I think the push really needs to be what are we voting for and I think we have to promote a

[00:35:33] a coherent message that isn't necessarily one issue or even a social issue it could be about

[00:35:39] rent it could be about a little wage it could be about health care it could be about the roads

[00:35:43] in Texas it could be the lack of new affordable housing infrastructure in Texas on a message that

[00:35:55] gives people a reason to register and vote and that's what I mean at local that's what I meant by

[00:36:01] local election because amendments and things that exact change for the cities that's on a local

[00:36:08] level those you know affordable housing women's rights all of that those are also those are done

[00:36:15] on the local level as well as the national level really amazing how we have to have keep

[00:36:21] having variations on the same chat because it's like well guys you know we we're told them to

[00:36:27] vote but they don't know why and so now that that is a cool chat to just kind of remember

[00:36:32] everybody you know what does this mean to you versus what do you want to have accomplished

[00:36:38] I mean people vote based on homeowners and property a lot of people vote on these things

[00:36:44] because this is the only thing that they are given is you know lower taxes so for a lot of people

[00:36:50] like renting which is a growing demographic for young people you know you don't really have as

[00:36:55] much rights or any rights compared to homeowners or anyone who owns property yeah so as individually

[00:37:02] you know there is real understandable like yeah I am individually benefiting but there is no

[00:37:08] organizing and you really do have to start organizing and there are a lot of small groups

[00:37:12] if you simply want to start learning how to or at least start you know getting real rather than

[00:37:19] just being online and then it's from there you start building out that collaboration because

[00:37:27] in the last years I've talked to many of the groups all of them are trying to connect

[00:37:32] but it's like everyone's doing it at the same time and you know trying to reach out to each other so

[00:37:37] it is growing and you'd be surprised how many groups are out there for all these issues and

[00:37:41] we are trying to hopefully collaborate and build a political movement that really does you know

[00:37:51] win seats that benefit people we have to show results we have to bring you know we

[00:37:55] got to bring home the bacon and and to that end you know it's it very well said thank you Amir

[00:38:06] and to that end really in our area anyway I have found as I said I'm a member of many of our

[00:38:11] organizations in the area and it's the Metroplex atheists are really the only ones that are

[00:38:18] overly political blatantly political in our in our message and in our mission

[00:38:26] fellowship or free thought Dallas is very big and one of its pillars of is community outreach

[00:38:32] in the DFW area so they have for they have several different other nonprofit organizations that

[00:38:40] they work with in our community we have I say we because I'm a member as I said a member of FOF as

[00:38:48] well there are several different community outreach programs that we do on a monthly basis

[00:38:54] and then we do one on a quarterly basis but the other the other organizations which I may

[00:39:01] as well mention here we have the Dallas Plano atheists and we have the humanists of Fort Worth

[00:39:07] and we also have the free thinkers of Fort Worth and then we also have the North Texas Church of

[00:39:12] Freethought um and you have all of these organizations and there is crossover in some

[00:39:23] but many of them are their own entities with their own uh their own um oh what's the word

[00:39:31] I'm looking for their own membership so like I happen to be a member of I'm an active member of

[00:39:41] three of the five I've mentioned um it's because I live in Dallas and it's being a being doing the

[00:39:52] Fort Worth stuff is a little bit of a stretch sometimes um but there are people who live in

[00:39:58] the Fort Worth area who are members of either the humanists of Fort Worth or the free thinkers of

[00:40:04] Fort Worth who maybe occasionally will come to an event of the Metro Plano atheists but they

[00:40:10] don't do anything with fellowship or free thought or Dallas Plano atheists and vice versa we have

[00:40:15] people who are on the Dallas side of the community who do very little on the Fort Worth

[00:40:18] side of the community and I think one of the things that Umir and I and several other members

[00:40:23] of fellowship for Freethought and the other organizations we in in the last little while

[00:40:28] more so than I've seen in the last nine years um and you know six years respectively with MA

[00:40:35] I find more recently that we're all coming together more to create a larger community

[00:40:44] and and to to the question that you asked about how can people get involved um most of our

[00:40:50] or all five of the organizations that I've mentioned are all able to be found on meetup

[00:40:56] so if you're not a member of Meetup that would be the quickest way okay go and and you know um

[00:41:06] what you find by doing the Meetup groups is that you find people within these organizations

[00:41:13] just like everything else in life you're gonna find people who are very like-minded thinkers

[00:41:20] who stand for the same things that you stand for and that you that you both have an opinion about um

[00:41:31] whether it you meet at a social event or you meet at a protest or you meet at the

[00:41:36] Peace Together Walk and and you go from there and you build those personal relationships

[00:41:42] and by building personal relationships with each other you build a bigger community

[00:41:48] and by building that larger community that's when we come together to fight for the things that matter

[00:41:57] okay sweet and uh yeah I've just meet up before um uh are there any other are you

[00:42:07] guys also big on social media or any other well I personally uh we we we Metroplex Atheist

[00:42:19] go ahead yeah we're on Facebook and Meetup currently I think in terms of social media

[00:42:26] I think you're gonna find a lot of different information some of it conflicting but if you

[00:42:32] are interested in these issues um and if you are concerned and not just secular Atheist group

[00:42:37] there are you know even political groups like the secular Democrats um and even you know

[00:42:44] religious groups that are part of it like uh I know I'm part of trying to get the interfaith alliance

[00:42:49] going um but I would say you can find it but you really do want to consider that there's only

[00:42:57] so much of a reach that you can do online right find something locally find something that I mean

[00:43:02] there's a saying in motorcycles is the best gear is the one that you're willing to wear

[00:43:07] I mean if what can you do in the real world because the internet kind of is making us in

[00:43:14] my opinion more alone more alienated and is not helping yes you're learning a lot but it just

[00:43:19] enters into the void so if you want to know how to make be a part of not just healing you know

[00:43:25] dealing with these problems but maybe even helping yourself I would say get real social you know

[00:43:30] join these groups just learn to build that because that's where it gets that's where it matters

[00:43:37] it's an old adage but it stands true here suit up and show up

[00:43:42] perfect put you know put your money where your mouth is if it's if it's a topic

[00:43:47] you know if you're a Democrat if you live in Dallas and you're a Democrat look into the secular

[00:43:52] Democrats of America there are non-profit organization here helping two people to understand

[00:43:59] the issues that's the people that get registered yeah that's the national name it's Secure Democrats

[00:44:04] of Texas for local one yeah local is of Texas and then we also have yeah and America is kind of like

[00:44:12] the American atheist and Metroplex atheists their sister organizations so the secular Democrats of

[00:44:17] Texas is a is a sister chapter local chapter thank you okay it's a political action committee

[00:44:28] basically but yeah they do a lot more if you want to learn about that there's there there and

[00:44:32] and you know I hope to start organizing with them and really building that structure so you know

[00:44:38] you're not like where do I go to find them there is one thing that they can all share and give out

[00:44:43] to everybody and then find you know what district am I in what groups are you know talking about

[00:44:49] these issues I mean I could go on and on and on there's so many of them but yeah that's a

[00:44:53] wonderful find I will be sure to look into them myself you know and good matter and different

[00:44:59] there are people who are members of our community who are not Democrat they are Republicans

[00:45:03] they still identify as Republicans and they vote as Republicans so there's a voice for everybody

[00:45:09] regardless of where you fall in the political or religious spectrums there's there's a place

[00:45:15] for everyone to have their voice heard um it's a matter of suiting up and showing up

[00:45:23] mm-hmm I noticed a lot when I was campaigning for Wendy Davis years ago and you know numerous

[00:45:32] you know she was another one who had kind of flipped on her ticket and the same kind of

[00:45:35] deal there a lot of her supporters were ones who were like we've stopped drinking the Kool-Aa

[00:45:39] we no longer believe in some of these radical causes uh we didn't know what we were really

[00:45:44] talking about and so it is interesting how so many people will change mentally and socially

[00:45:50] and just kind of realize the most recent politically speaking the most recent is

[00:45:56] Eric Johnson the mayor of the city of Dallas he ran on a democratic ticket and now he's

[00:46:02] flipped the page and he's saying he's a Republican now

[00:46:07] and people in Dallas are calling for his resignation because they feel they've been defrauded

[00:46:14] in case you hadn't heard that story I definitely am not I had heard how he was getting

[00:46:19] popular and yeah that's that's bad I don't know if you've heard that story Amir

[00:46:28] I haven't followed that one specifically closely I think I think again like until you have

[00:46:37] you know actual structures that are built around these things and we are seeing that like the

[00:46:41] union um strikes once you start seeing more and more of that and people say what can I do

[00:46:49] and what how can I not support them or even you know how can I talk about how this

[00:46:56] how these issues impact all of us and bring that collective consciousness and understand

[00:47:03] that you do need to build that local thing I mean even in you could at a local level you could

[00:47:10] turn an election in a matter of a few hundred votes really not even that much

[00:47:15] and if you can if you have a room full of a hundred people or even online and you can commit

[00:47:20] you know a percentage of them like one percent you know you've got a hundred votes if you if

[00:47:24] they if you can find 10 of them that are you know willing to walk and talk to knock on doors

[00:47:32] you can ask them to do that and let have them find 10 people and you've got you know a

[00:47:37] thousand votes there it's simply it's simply just building that structure that because right

[00:47:42] now I mean I remember after COVID you know looking for groups I'm I just typed in you know

[00:47:48] atheist communities and there was like nothing so I'm hoping to change that and I mean a lot of

[00:47:53] people are again secular groups atheist groups or sorry interfaith groups are trying to start

[00:47:59] you know building that structure and collaboration especially in Texas because so much of what our

[00:48:04] government is doing right now is really getting national awareness well and it's just one of

[00:48:10] those where people just got to be even more in tune instead of just hate watching getting

[00:48:16] or getting stressed out at news reports just pay attention to so many different causes you know

[00:48:22] just keep a lookout for bad apples like the Joe Mansions and Kristen Sinema's of the world who

[00:48:29] are claiming to be part of a cause then you'd read between the lines and it's like no they're

[00:48:33] not doing anything even remotely close to what they claim to be representing

[00:48:37] and it's just eye-opening too because we used to think hey pretty straightforward you got to be

[00:48:46] honest right and everything else is subjective it's like well no there there's several layers to it

[00:48:54] yeah what you think about this for for I moved to Texas when I was nine years old in 1982

[00:49:03] oh and and and Richard was voted in as governor in 1984

[00:49:10] right 100 million yeah we're right Democrat and female

[00:49:17] almost 40 years ago since she left office we have not had a Democratic governor in office since

[00:49:31] and I think that is very telling as well as why people who do identify as Democrat don't vote

[00:49:43] I think it's more of like the absence of a historical context of these things like if you

[00:49:48] asked most people even as I was growing up oh Texas has been a Republican state since its

[00:49:54] founding where they you know what is it the Alamo you know but in reality Texas had actual

[00:50:02] union labor structure I mean Texas was a blue farmers but if you talk to most people

[00:50:12] they couldn't imagine such a thing happening in Texas because a lot of that history to a degree

[00:50:17] for the sake of you know I like to call it abstinence only education where it's about denying

[00:50:22] people any information or critical thinking tools judgment so you can basically tell

[00:50:29] America is what Texas is or where Christianity is for the record Dallas County was founded in 1849

[00:50:37] yeah I think I you know if people think Texas is a Republican state it's like no somebody made

[00:50:43] it Republican and there is that history of literally deconstructing all the systems

[00:50:49] and that it's easy to break you know burn down a building it's hard to actually build one

[00:50:53] absolutely yeah

[00:50:57] again very well said that's so true and it doesn't get any easier either

[00:51:06] I mean yeah I mean they are I think a lot of the Christian fundamentalists even though

[00:51:11] they're a group of this ideology they're very individualistic they're just you know that's why

[00:51:18] you know I like to put no honor among thieves they'll eat each other eventually as they are doing now

[00:51:24] but for us we're not necessarily playing the same game I mean it really is about community

[00:51:28] solidarity love in the sense that you give a part of yourself to others in the faith that

[00:51:34] that is what's real which you know it's a hard thing to do it takes you know and because we live in

[00:51:43] such a divisive society now across the board you know religion divides politics divide I don't like

[00:51:55] the way you look I don't agree with what you stand for yeah you know I don't agree with your

[00:52:01] sexuality or your orientation um there is so much division among

[00:52:09] all groups I mean yep and I hate to say but even even in the free thinking at atheist community

[00:52:19] not everybody agrees or believes the same way because at the end of the day we're all still

[00:52:25] individuals you know I will say that in the atheist community they do tend to be a little

[00:52:33] bit more forgiving a little bit more understanding and a little bit more accepting than say the

[00:52:39] fundamental Christians yeah we're all um go ahead Umir now I was gonna say we're just gonna add

[00:52:47] to that like we're all atomized individuals the history of people responding to whatever they see

[00:52:54] and that becoming a focus like I like to talk about how people becoming uh afraid of being

[00:53:00] attacked by sharks after jaws came out because they thought you know they were gonna get attacked

[00:53:05] by sharks in a lake or in American coast where there's never been a shark attack and most

[00:53:11] shark attacks happened in Australia or other places in America it and of course the and

[00:53:16] it's just become accelerated with the internet and like I just like to say you know you have

[00:53:20] if you want to do something you have to get real you have to you have to start

[00:53:23] building those relationships and know what it means to actually connect with people and

[00:53:28] you know deal with these real world problems because on the internet it's just it's a tv show

[00:53:33] it's red versus blue I mean what do you watch do you watch what youtube channel or q and on or

[00:53:37] whatever don't trump is the wrestler yeah it's like do you watch pox news or cnn it's

[00:53:45] yeah there's even even among even among even among the pundits there's just there is so much

[00:53:51] division you know and for what it's worth I'm I'm quite a bit older than both of you and I mean

[00:53:56] that in a most respectful amount condescending way um but I have a different frame of reference too

[00:54:02] um because I did grow up in the 80s and I was born in 73 I'm 50 um you know I have I have a

[00:54:10] 31 year old and a 24 year old daughter and back when I was growing up I'm not saying that this

[00:54:16] wasn't going on and I'm not saying that people weren't just as divided but it wasn't as acceptable

[00:54:25] to wear it on your sleeve the way it is now this outward hate towards other communities

[00:54:35] yep you know I'm not saying that people I apologize I mean I'm not saying that people

[00:54:41] I'm not saying anti-semitism didn't exist but it was not as overt as it is in 2023

[00:54:53] I'm not saying that the fear of Muslims or Middle Easterners didn't exist

[00:55:00] but until 9-11 it wasn't it wasn't talked about in the same way it wasn't regarded in the same way

[00:55:13] people didn't outwardly hate in the same way because of fear of what would happen if they did

[00:55:20] but now because you have so many people agree with you it's okay to hate groups and marginalized

[00:55:26] you know it's okay to hate marginalized groups in large numbers because they're as they say

[00:55:31] their safety in numbers yeah they can cling on to someone else who's also a commudian just like them

[00:55:38] exactly who feels the same way that you do and so there's there's larger communities now

[00:55:46] oh what's the name of the group that I'm thinking of the men's organization

[00:55:52] and seeing the stickers on the backs of the trucks

[00:55:58] sure I've really followed that you basically they're basically anti-semitic bigots

[00:56:08] you know they're white supremacists and white supremacy has been around forever

[00:56:15] but people don't you always had your outspoken with the KKK and all that

[00:56:21] but I find more in 2023 that there is more derision and there are people who are a lot more blatant

[00:56:30] about their hatred against Jews against Muslims against immigrants against the LGBT community

[00:56:38] against women's rights all of these hotbed topic issues there is a lot more derision

[00:56:47] and a lot more hatred in society today again I'm not saying it didn't exist before

[00:56:54] I'm saying it's more visible now well especially with the internet yeah exact that's and that is

[00:57:02] exactly what Umiyar was talking to because what are you reading what are you looking up what you

[00:57:09] people find on the internet groups and organizations that align with what they already believe to be true

[00:57:18] yep yeah even if there's no truth in the even if there's no basis of truth in that issue

[00:57:26] they find people that agree with what they already believe they feel validated even though

[00:57:31] they that's more depth they're validated in the way in their way of thinking in their hatred

[00:57:39] I would I would try to like even add more to that in the historical context of how

[00:57:46] you know what that's saying history doesn't repeat itself but it has a it has a rhyme

[00:57:52] like right now not associated with it but there's a book that recently came out called

[00:57:56] far right vanguard their radical roots of modern conservatism which goes back much further than

[00:58:02] Reagan and it really does get into how you know these groups come into focus how they are very much

[00:58:10] you know vague and broad and how they you know just keep trying to like bring their message into

[00:58:18] mainstream and under certain conditions they you know rise into power like right now there is a

[00:58:24] you know there is an economic crisis since 2008 there hasn't been a good response or reasonable one

[00:58:29] that helped people even after the pandemic you know and so no one's really no one's really voting for

[00:58:36] anything I mean I'd like to put like Trump trumped in win Hillary Clinton epically lost as one of the

[00:58:43] lowest turnout since World War two and in the moment which was the most I think the most

[00:58:49] highly televised digital election in the history of America and yet fewer people voted than anything

[00:58:56] I mean Donald Trump and if fewer people vote that small minority of right wing you know modern

[00:59:04] conservatives win yeah you've got to give them something real you got to talk about real issues

[00:59:10] and there really isn't that structure and I mean I mean it's kind of like you don't have to

[00:59:18] say well they're great at it it's like what are they doing to get there and how do you build that

[00:59:23] you may have to have a lot of losses every day but I mean you have to have that why and it's

[00:59:28] it's not going to get better and you don't have to do alone so even if the world burns

[00:59:32] who are you standing next to the next day you know that's gonna that sounds nihilistic and

[00:59:38] really I don't believe that's the outcome I think what matters is you're gonna have people to be

[00:59:42] with and that only happens when you kind of recognize that these people have always been around and

[00:59:49] they're mental Bolo in a way yeah I'm gonna look out for this kind of behavior I mean the solution

[00:59:56] to us isn't I mean you can talk about their what they do as their method strategy and you know

[01:00:02] what they're doing right now but you know get your house in order and I don't mean your actual

[01:00:08] house I know literally yeah well I mean I was being sarcastic but like you know get organized do

[01:00:18] do the thing that's gonna make you and you know your district because that's how this system is played

[01:00:25] work there you go all right well that's been a good chat guys and I really hope nothing

[01:00:33] but the best I hope there's ways to just keep having these conversations yeah we would love to see

[01:00:39] one of our events absolutely well camp um yeah I'm sure you'll you know if we keep it up I'm sure

[01:00:47] you'll hear of us again I'll I'll keep following you guys see thank you for having us anytime thank

[01:00:55] you for having us take thanks for taking the time to speak with us tonight and I hope more people

[01:01:00] get rallied up to your cause take care thank you very much all right got to be good take care bye bye bye

[01:01:08] we'll return after these messages the jacked up review show podcast is honored to be part of

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