Touchless Orgasm: A Chat About Pleasure w/Jenn Wodtke, Pleasure & Orgasm Coach

[00:00:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome to Dose of Depth podcast. I'm your host, Deborah Lukovich, and I invite you to explore what's beneath the surface of all sorts of things, including your own life.

[00:00:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Through conversation, stories, and education, you'll see what you couldn't see before, find new meaning in old events, and even discover a new sense of purpose out there in the world. Let's get started.

[00:00:30] [SPEAKER_01]: In this episode, I get to talk about one of my favorite topics, the intertwining of sexuality and spirituality. I introduced you to Pleasure and Orgasm Coach, Jenn Wodtke, a couple months ago.

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_01]: We took on the topic of sex from two angles. Gens was the literal and practical and mine was the symbolic and deeper meaning of sexuality,

[00:00:51] [SPEAKER_01]: which is about allowing creative intelligence to flow through you to create what only you and it can create together in partnership.

[00:01:00] [SPEAKER_01]: Surrendering to this union of self and divine unleashes creative expression meant to expand human consciousness.

[00:01:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Jenn is back, and today we're going to focus on Touchless Orgasm, which Jenn's website describes as a revolutionary shift in how women can experience pleasure.

[00:01:18] [SPEAKER_01]: Instead of relying on external stimulation, hands, a toy, a partner, erotic novels, Touchless Orgasm allows you to find the pleasure that is already inside you.

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_01]: I'll bet you're already having some kind of reaction based on all those unconscious and conscious limiting beliefs about the role of pleasure.

[00:01:35] [SPEAKER_01]: But there was a time when the union between the feminine and masculine as manifested in sexual union was celebrated as sacred.

[00:01:43] [SPEAKER_01]: There was a time when the feminine was seen and experienced as the path to the spiritual realm.

[00:01:49] [SPEAKER_01]: And then came patriarchal forces that resulted from living in scarcity and which continue to be maintained through different forms of violence, whether economic, psychological or physical.

[00:02:01] [SPEAKER_01]: These new aggressive forces also happened to clash with the development of religious doctrine, for example, Christian doctrine, which split off the feminine and denigrated the feminine.

[00:02:12] [SPEAKER_01]: The march towards sacralizing suffering instead of pleasure began.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Reconnecting with the inner feminine requires vulnerability, which is not so easy in a culture that has a warped definition of what it means to be strong.

[00:02:25] [SPEAKER_01]: It's time to course correct, not by overcompensating and cheapening sexuality.

[00:02:30] [SPEAKER_01]: We have already done that by focusing on quantity and techniques, which also just scratches the surface of the deeper meaning of sexuality and pleasure.

[00:02:39] [SPEAKER_01]: There's purpose to arousal, attraction, and the awkwardness of intimate connection is not always about the desire to have literal sex.

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_01]: There I go with my depth psychology lens.

[00:02:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Jen's work with mostly women is about healing, inner reconciliation and accessing the inner divine, which is the bridge to what transcends us.

[00:02:59] [SPEAKER_01]: Call it God, nature, the quantum realm or the field of infinite possibilities.

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Some of you are already there. You're ready for this.

[00:03:06] [SPEAKER_01]: For those of you who might cringe during our chat, hang in there and notice the underlying emotion, especially if it's shame or embarrassment.

[00:03:15] [SPEAKER_01]: There's your invitation to dig deeper.

[00:03:18] [SPEAKER_01]: You might not be ready for touchless orgasm, but you might be ready for me to help you explore what's holding you back from self intimacy,

[00:03:25] [SPEAKER_01]: which also holds you back from deep connection with your partner, other human beings and even God.

[00:03:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Coming into deeper relationship with yourself is arousing and necessary to cross the bridge to unite with the divine, which is most definitely arousing.

[00:03:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I experienced this myself and it's what led me to a new sense of purpose and creative unleashing.

[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_01]: That story might come up during our chat.

[00:03:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Why wouldn't it be pleasurable to connect with the source of everything?

[00:03:52] [SPEAKER_01]: So let's get started.

[00:03:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, hey Jen, welcome back. How are you doing?

[00:03:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm doing great Deb. How are you?

[00:04:00] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm excellent and you know how I love to talk about this topic and you're one of the few people I can talk about it with.

[00:04:07] [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, why don't we just start with you saying what's going on in your life in general?

[00:04:13] [SPEAKER_01]: And then, yeah, you're planning on going to Japan or back to Japan and somehow pole dancing is in there too.

[00:04:20] [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, like just reacquaint us.

[00:04:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I've been in Mexico now for almost a full year.

[00:04:28] [SPEAKER_00]: So it is time. I know. I can't believe it's been a year.

[00:04:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't even know you were in Mexico.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, good.

[00:04:33] [SPEAKER_01]: I love the virtual world. You never know where people are.

[00:04:36] [SPEAKER_00]: So I've been in Mexico.

[00:04:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Definitely ready to move on.

[00:04:39] [SPEAKER_00]: So I travel out a week from when we're recording, spend some time with friends and family.

[00:04:46] [SPEAKER_00]: And then, yeah, I'm heading over to Japan.

[00:04:50] [SPEAKER_00]: I taught there when I was a fresh faced 22 year old and finally got back much later in life

[00:04:59] [SPEAKER_00]: and sort of was able to sort of kind of engage and be in Japan in a way that is just different now

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_00]: because you're older and wiser and maybe have a little bit more money than you did when you were 22, right?

[00:05:09] [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, I'm really just looking forward to being back in Tokyo

[00:05:12] [SPEAKER_00]: and just a totally different culture and perspective than Mexico.

[00:05:19] [SPEAKER_00]: And for pole dancing, I started pole dancing back in 2012 back in Vancouver,

[00:05:24] [SPEAKER_00]: but I just haven't been really consistent with it.

[00:05:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Like work and life got busy so I would stop going to classes.

[00:05:31] [SPEAKER_00]: Japan has a couple of really great studios, Tokyo specifically.

[00:05:34] [SPEAKER_00]: I've kind of just, you know, in Mexico I've had my head down.

[00:05:38] [SPEAKER_00]: I've been working and coaching and building programs and all of this stuff.

[00:05:42] [SPEAKER_00]: So going back to Tokyo, I'm like, I need to go out more.

[00:05:44] [SPEAKER_00]: I need to start dancing again and connecting with my feminine, my sexy, my sensual.

[00:05:48] [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I'm going to hit a pole studio.

[00:05:51] [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm looking forward to reconnecting with that

[00:05:54] [SPEAKER_00]: and seeing what my body can remember how to do and what my body has forgotten.

[00:06:01] [SPEAKER_00]: So that's...

[00:06:02] [SPEAKER_01]: I love it.

[00:06:03] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, that's a perfect example of the fluid nature between the feminine and the masculine.

[00:06:08] [SPEAKER_01]: Sometimes we need to call on our masculine to do, to follow through, to execute, right?

[00:06:14] [SPEAKER_01]: But the inspiration for their creativity is the realm of the feminine, which is the body.

[00:06:19] [SPEAKER_01]: And so after being heavy in the mind, you know, and the masculine,

[00:06:24] [SPEAKER_01]: it makes perfect sense that you need to sort of like go back and get reacquainted with that feminine.

[00:06:30] [SPEAKER_01]: So I can't wait for what comes out of that.

[00:06:34] [SPEAKER_01]: So before we get to the concept of touchless orgasm,

[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_01]: tell my listeners how you came to be a pleasure and orgasm coach.

[00:06:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And like, you know, what is that journey about?

[00:06:46] [SPEAKER_01]: And what comes to mind for me always when I ask people this question is like that saying we teach what we need to learn.

[00:06:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Like, oh, I'm a deaf psychology coach, which means, oh, like all these things I help my clients with

[00:06:58] [SPEAKER_01]: are mirror back what I need to learn myself.

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_01]: So I suspect that's part of your journey too.

[00:07:02] [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, like how did it all happen?

[00:07:05] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I think the biggest moment for me that sort of started me on my journey to being a pleasure and orgasm coach,

[00:07:10] [SPEAKER_00]: which was a long, windy, like over decade long journey, was when I got divorced,

[00:07:18] [SPEAKER_00]: I thought like I assume everybody does when they get married that it was going to be happy,

[00:07:22] [SPEAKER_00]: happily ever after. Everything was going to be great.

[00:07:25] [SPEAKER_00]: And I got divorced less than two years later.

[00:07:27] [SPEAKER_00]: And I remember just very vividly thinking like, man, I've been lied to about relationships and what this looks like.

[00:07:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And I kind of went, what else did they lie about?

[00:07:39] [SPEAKER_00]: And woven into that for me was just this like I was like, I'm going to go buy some corsets and I'm going to buy like sexy shoes

[00:07:46] [SPEAKER_00]: and I'm going to like explore and do all these things.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_00]: So the dissolution of my marriage really coincided with a desire to really blossom into my sexuality.

[00:07:55] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think in large part that was because when I wouldn't have said it at the time, but looking back when I was younger,

[00:08:01] [SPEAKER_00]: I had taken on a lot of sort of negative feelings about my body, negative feelings about my sexuality.

[00:08:09] [SPEAKER_00]: Like it wasn't really safe to be sexual.

[00:08:12] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I have the experience that so many of us have when I started growing.

[00:08:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I have big boobs and I had big boobs when I was younger, you know, being 14 and having men yell things at me,

[00:08:24] [SPEAKER_00]: you know, as they drove by in their car.

[00:08:26] [SPEAKER_00]: So and again, I wouldn't have articulated it at the time.

[00:08:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't even think it was true at the time.

[00:08:30] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think what happened is I took on this like, like being sexual is a little bit scary.

[00:08:36] [SPEAKER_00]: It's not really safe.

[00:08:37] [SPEAKER_00]: And there's a lot of slut shaming in the 90s when I was in high school and junior high rates that all got turned off.

[00:08:44] [SPEAKER_00]: And so then here I was, you know, 20.

[00:08:48] [SPEAKER_00]: No, I was 30, just turned 30 and divorced and was like, I just felt my whole world opening.

[00:08:54] [SPEAKER_00]: So I kind of immediately started dabbling in various different ways to explore my sexuality.

[00:09:02] [SPEAKER_00]: I've been Pauly, I've attended some swingers events and then through that kind of just had this growing certainty inside of me

[00:09:13] [SPEAKER_00]: that this is this is the way to power.

[00:09:18] [SPEAKER_00]: Like if we can fully sexually express whatever that means, and it's so individual,

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_00]: we all have different sexual expressions and wants and desires and orientations and genders and all of that.

[00:09:29] [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, if you're not allowed to do that, like you have absolute control of a person.

[00:09:36] [SPEAKER_00]: So it just sort of organically grew out of me that this was the way to and again, I would have used the words at the time,

[00:09:42] [SPEAKER_00]: but I knew that my sexuality was the way to move, begin moving into empowerment.

[00:09:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I love that so much and we're of different generations, but I can relate to I would have hoped it would have been better by the time you got to the 90s.

[00:09:57] [SPEAKER_01]: But I came of age in the 80s.

[00:09:59] [SPEAKER_01]: And during the 80s, there was this unleashing of women's anger about like, you're not going to tell me what to do.

[00:10:06] [SPEAKER_01]: And so, you know, in the late 80s, I was like, I could go upset.

[00:10:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And I can't be a slut.

[00:10:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, you know, I remember when I met my now former husband we're like, we're both sluts.

[00:10:20] [SPEAKER_01]: We're like just claimed it, you know, but it was interesting because before him,

[00:10:25] [SPEAKER_01]: my men didn't know what to do with my sexual hunger and assertiveness.

[00:10:29] [SPEAKER_01]: And I ended up feeling rejected, not because they didn't like me because like they liked me.

[00:10:35] [SPEAKER_01]: But it was like every time I made the move or I express like this, I was the one who was like initiating and they were the ones like to slow me down.

[00:10:48] [SPEAKER_01]: And the message was so like there were so many just mixed messages.

[00:10:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And of course, like you say in hindsight, you know, I write about this as in my memoir and those experiences.

[00:10:59] [SPEAKER_01]: You sort of brush them off at the time, but they leave an imprint in your psyche.

[00:11:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And so part of my unraveling, which also meant the ending of my 24 year marriage, all of this wounding came out.

[00:11:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, also women don't understand that, you know, those that our sexuality is feared by men because we have this impact on them.

[00:11:27] [SPEAKER_01]: We can give them a boner and that's terrifying sometimes they like they're not aware of like.

[00:11:34] [SPEAKER_01]: And so we know that this violence has to do is rooted in fear.

[00:11:40] [SPEAKER_01]: So this fear, I'm going to talk a little bit about patriarchal wound, but the fear of their inner feminine is what gets projected onto actual women.

[00:11:49] [SPEAKER_01]: And in order to, you know, deal with that fear, they have to control or they have to belittle or whatever it is.

[00:11:57] [SPEAKER_01]: So that's I love your story.

[00:12:00] [SPEAKER_00]: And what you said is just so absolutely true and it's so limiting on both sides, right?

[00:12:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you know, men have built culture.

[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_00]: They're the ones who've built a culture that we, you know, for millennia and the one that we're still living in.

[00:12:13] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think absolutely you hit the nail on the head that they inherently, even if they won't acknowledge it like up in the head,

[00:12:19] [SPEAKER_00]: They know that a woman who is in her power and in her sexual power is utterly unstoppable.

[00:12:25] [SPEAKER_00]: They fear it and they have put all these restrictions and, you know, acceptable behavior rules into place.

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_00]: Most there are still this notion that women don't initiate, women don't chase, women don't like.

[00:12:39] [SPEAKER_00]: Is that real? Is that actually true?

[00:12:42] [SPEAKER_00]: Or is it like generations of conditioning so that women, men wouldn't have to come up against the female sexuality and look at themselves?

[00:12:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. And that, you know, that speaks to their patriarchal wounds.

[00:12:58] [SPEAKER_01]: So as, you know, in or, you know, women's, you know, how did they heal?

[00:13:04] [SPEAKER_01]: They take power.

[00:13:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, how do men heal?

[00:13:07] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, men have to redefine what a strength and they have to redefine power.

[00:13:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And really the ultimate strength is to withstand vulnerability to deeply connect.

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_01]: And so the men patriarchal wound is almost more sinister because it's also other men who emasculate men who step out of line.

[00:13:25] [SPEAKER_01]: So it's just, you know, it's just so sad.

[00:13:27] [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, these false, I don't know, false narratives really keep us from men and women from being who they, you know, who they're who are they supposed to be.

[00:13:39] [SPEAKER_01]: So, yeah, so we really address sort of the same, the same thing.

[00:13:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:13:44] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think we're I think we're at a really interesting moment in time where I think men are having to redefine that more than ever with the Me Too movement and all of these, you know, time up things that have been happening.

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_00]: And I logically am aware of that.

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sympathetic.

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_00]: But at the same time, it's like, I can't hold this for men.

[00:14:04] [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I need, I need to reclaim my power and I don't have the bandwidth to hold space for you to work out that your redefinition, like you moving into vulnerability.

[00:14:18] [SPEAKER_00]: And it's this, I don't know.

[00:14:20] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know what the answer is, but it's.

[00:14:22] [SPEAKER_01]: You know, my, my millennial men friends totally agree with you.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_01]: Like I happen to have more empathy and compassion for men, especially coming of age in the 80s because I was that woman who was like, no, you don't have to hold the door open for me.

[00:14:34] [SPEAKER_01]: Let me hold it open for you.

[00:14:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Don't buy me flowers.

[00:14:37] [SPEAKER_01]: And sometimes I feel like I was like I think about cringe moments where it's like, oh, that's kind of that was kind of mean.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[00:14:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And so it's not my responsibility.

[00:14:46] [SPEAKER_01]: However, you know, we don't have to compare our wounds and what was interesting after I submitted my, my dissertation which explored women's experience of reconciling sexuality and spirituality is I went to speak at a college and it was most, it was all women actually who attended, but it was women.

[00:15:05] [SPEAKER_01]: And it was, it was also like there were nuns there.

[00:15:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And so some of the people attended my workshop were like 75 year old feminist nuns.

[00:15:16] [SPEAKER_01]: And what was interesting is that the women there, the way I was talking about it is that they suddenly had this insight that, oh, you mean I can hold space and honor my wound, but I don't have to like compete with somebody else's wounds that I can honor mine but I also can honor this

[00:15:36] [SPEAKER_01]: warped patriarchal wounds that men have to so I also think there's growing capacity for us for women to appreciate that men actually do have a patriarchal wound and it's not patriarchy is not about men.

[00:15:51] [SPEAKER_01]: It's about systems.

[00:15:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And so you know luckily, you know there is a shift happening right now and there are what I call a great number of quality men who are not threatened by equality. Right. And so it is in that way it's kind of an exciting time to because something new is going to come out of all this chaos and it's going to be consciousness expansion, it's that's going to win out so.

[00:16:16] [SPEAKER_01]: So anyway, so you teachers so let's talk more about how when you work with clients, you're, you're really

[00:16:28] [SPEAKER_01]: allowing them to have the experience of what happens when you tap into your inner feminine. So, you know, talk more about that.

[00:16:36] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we, you know, every client is different.

[00:16:41] [SPEAKER_00]: The sort of the recurring theme that I've been finding lately with my clients is there is a disconnect.

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think part of a disconnect with a feminine and I think part of that goes back to the system of the patriarchy where the whole world is sort of defaulted to how men more naturally are like they're more natural ways of behaving more, you know, competitive, more action oriented.

[00:17:05] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't mean aggressive in a negative turn but they're more out there. And, and which actually in which actually we don't know if that's natural. Yes, 100% 100% yes thank you for for clarifying that yes agree 100%.

[00:17:20] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, yes, absolutely.

[00:17:24] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think what happens is we all regardless of gender men women, gender fluid.

[00:17:30] [SPEAKER_00]: We need to survive in this system so getting ahead is often engaging in these what we consider to be traditional male behaviors and I think for a lot of people and men to men have a feminine inside of them.

[00:17:46] [SPEAKER_00]: We don't connect with that feminine as often just because it's, you know, not really valued as much you know how did you how did you come to that conclusion well it just feels right and that's not really valued but that's so incredibly valuable valuable right.

[00:18:01] [SPEAKER_00]: So, a lot of the work kind of helps my clients. Like let's find what that feminine is like what do you feel like what is your wounding around the feminine right and some people will say things like, you know, maybe I didn't have a good mother figure or the feminine is weak or I just don't feel her, whatever

[00:18:20] [SPEAKER_00]: And then we sort of work on what's underneath that, and how do you find the strength and the power in the feminine because the feminine is not weak and the masculine is not inherently strong like they're equal right they're different but they're equal and the feminine is not passive.

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_00]: No, to receive is to choose to to allow. Yes, yeah. So we do a lot of sort of that uncovering what the wounding is what the wounding is, and then reconnecting and sort of rebuilding almost the feminine and learning how to.

[00:18:50] [SPEAKER_00]: Sort of live in that live in that energy more in a way that is supportive to the client's individual sort of ecology of their life.

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, what's an example of like when one of your clients gets it.

[00:19:02] [SPEAKER_00]: It's so amazing to watch them connect.

[00:19:06] [SPEAKER_00]: And I found when they really connect with a feminine or whatever they happen to be working on something adjacent.

[00:19:12] [SPEAKER_00]: When they make that connection, they just naturally start bringing it forward into their life and then they come and they tell me they're like oh you know this came up but like I realized that it was my masculine who's going no no no don't do this.

[00:19:26] [SPEAKER_00]: And then my feminine, I listened to my feminine and she told me to like be kinder and more compassionate and that he has a different way of doing things and they, and I just watch them like, because you don't give them real life.

[00:19:37] [SPEAKER_00]: Do this do that right you give them the ability to find it in themselves and then just to watch them like explain how it starts showing up in their life all the time and now they see it and they're aware of it and that I think is a really big key once you become aware of what your wounds are.

[00:19:52] [SPEAKER_00]: And you start working on healing them and connecting with your feminine masculine, whatever it is you're working on.

[00:19:58] [SPEAKER_00]: That awareness is the first step and then you can't stop noticing all your patterns and all your behaviors and once you are aware of them like that's when I start to see people just massively change.

[00:20:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Then there's a tipping point well I like the example that you shared, especially the one like, oh, you know, that reaction that person has doesn't even have to do with me.

[00:20:23] [SPEAKER_01]: But I was giving it meaning based on these different voices, right and and we can have like a wounded mother the like controlling mean mother or we can have also the the father who is the mean you know they can both be negative versions of.

[00:20:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Mother and father right so so you know it could come from either, either one of those.

[00:20:48] [SPEAKER_01]: But as soon as you realize that your emotional reaction is about you.

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And not them right there that's empowering so you're sort of giving them a framework where they're like oh the feminine is more fluid and meandering and not so rigid and is is like connection oriented and the masculine is maybe a little more serious and linear and let's get down to business and.

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_01]: And that natural that is the natural masculine aggression doesn't even really have to do it right because the mother the feminine can be a ranger.

[00:21:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh yeah.

[00:21:23] [SPEAKER_01]: And so the aggression isn't something that's tied to the masculine it's just different versions of it so you're giving them a framework where they begin to maybe be more aware of assumptions that they're making as they're going about their day and then they can counter.

[00:21:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And probably you talk about how their emotions are key right so if there's an emotion of like fear or shame or whatever like maybe I need to listen to a different voice.

[00:21:50] [SPEAKER_00]: You know one of my favorite examples from my own life that just happened about because I grew up in the same under the same patriarchal system and I've been sort of doing my own work around my reclaiming my own feminine and getting into it deeper and.

[00:22:03] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean you and I met through some business training which I felt was very like traditionally male like great.

[00:22:13] [SPEAKER_00]: And you know I was out at a Starbucks this is one of my favorite things that's happened to me in this.

[00:22:18] [SPEAKER_00]: This is like the purpose for me to come to Mexico I think so that at Starbucks this woman walked by and I stopped her I was like I just I need to talk to this woman so I stopped her.

[00:22:30] [SPEAKER_00]: She was like who are you your red lipstick and your glasses so I was like come sit with me for a moment just have like let's have our coffee together and she talked about her work I talked about my work we had so much overlap.

[00:22:43] [SPEAKER_00]: We're now hosting a woman's pussy power retreat together at the end of January details details are not yet ironed out but it's like it was just this synergy you know I had been working so hard in my business like doing all these like list of these tasks and stuff.

[00:22:58] [SPEAKER_00]: And I have these 10 things to do this week and these three things to do today and if I don't do it I'm a failure all the stuff and then I'm just like being who I am like tuned into what feels like collaborative and energetic and.

[00:23:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Like this is the this retreat is going to be the most amazing thing that's happened to my business yet and it's.

[00:23:17] [SPEAKER_00]: It was easy and I think.

[00:23:19] [SPEAKER_00]: There's something for me and that I find being in the feminine that it's just like that that flow that alignment it's receptive like and it.

[00:23:30] [SPEAKER_00]: And that's power like I feel so powerful as a result of this interaction you know in this retreat that we're having but it's like.

[00:23:41] [SPEAKER_00]: That was the power of me in my feminine being who I am naturally like talking is talking to strangers and all that stuff and it's like wow.

[00:23:51] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just another perfect example of like the that we need to it's not to be feminine or masculine it's like which one is the right one right now.

[00:24:02] [SPEAKER_01]: And you were so to be in the feminine is to be receptive to another kind of wisdom so the masculine is of the mind and the five senses but there's another kind of intelligence the sixth sense you could call it the intuition.

[00:24:17] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's in the body and the body is the feminine and so the wisdom from the body so like you communicated something and you received something from her and then you acted on it the masculine is the acting on it.

[00:24:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, is the action yeah yeah exactly exactly yeah.

[00:24:41] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yeah I mean what a beautiful example so the masculine acted on it and then what happened the your feminine and masculine then created something new.

[00:24:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And that is the result of reconciling the feminine masculine and sexuality and spirituality is creativity not always a baby.

[00:25:04] [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, yes.

[00:25:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Creativity of an idea creativity of nature whatever so I love it so talk about sisterhood because that's something you say I'm particularly passionate about sisterhood and you know that's a term that's been around for decades but I'm always curious about what is it what does it mean to you and what does it mean for you for you to be in

[00:25:30] [SPEAKER_01]: sisterhood with other women.

[00:25:33] [SPEAKER_00]: I think the biggest thing for me is just this supporting each other and high tide floats all boats like I'm not I'm not in competition with women, maybe I was when I was younger.

[00:25:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes I think the world.

[00:25:49] [SPEAKER_00]: The way it's structured can encourage women to compete against each other and you know and in the past it was more dire right you had to you had to compete because there is no way to get resources on your own for very large numbers of women throughout history, but that's shifted

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_00]: now and it's like we can all run our own business we can all find the partner of our dreams we don't need to compete for limited resources and I think for me to part of that realization is like there's unlimited resources in the world.

[00:26:20] [SPEAKER_00]: So I want every woman that I cross paths with to be living her best life fulfilled life for her to have a thriving business if that's what she wants thriving family if that's what she wants whatever she wants.

[00:26:33] [SPEAKER_00]: I want her to have it and to be living her life in a way that makes her just fully alive and joyful, whatever that looks like and it's different for every woman.

[00:26:42] [SPEAKER_01]: I love it. It will trashes that myth that there's actually limitation, there aren't really, I mean even in the world there aren't limited resources.

[00:26:52] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just this patriarchy creates the idea that there is and that's the only way you get them is through this. So in fact I was just came across this, this image on Facebook and it was about a community who has built a kind of urban garden that actually feeds 2000 people for free.

[00:27:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Who is making money on that? That would be somebody's first thing is like well you know they'd start asking the wrong questions as opposed to like oh that's a really cool idea how do we replicate that.

[00:27:25] [SPEAKER_01]: You know so I love it and then I was going to ask you about, you know when I, you know me I'm always a depth psychology person so I'm looking at the symbolism so sisterhood you know what, what is that are we talking about that from a gender perspective that it's women or is it like

[00:27:43] [SPEAKER_01]: supporting each other in claiming our feminine and also having a healthier relationship with our masculine and then in that way it can really transcend you know, you know sisterhood as a biology thing or as a gender construct.

[00:28:01] [SPEAKER_01]: So I was just wondering about your thoughts about that.

[00:28:04] [SPEAKER_00]: This is a very articulate answer.

[00:28:08] [SPEAKER_00]: But something you said just really landed and I was like that's what it is. It's that sisterhood is connecting with the feminine. I do think, I mean being a cis woman is, I love being a cis woman.

[00:28:21] [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that's the only way to be a woman. I don't think inclusivity, including everybody who lives a female life or female bodied life or chooses to live that way.

[00:28:34] [SPEAKER_00]: There's I think the energy around it is what I consider sisterhood and just supporting women. I just feel, I don't know it's that collaboration. I feel, I mean I love men and want to have relationships with men.

[00:28:48] [SPEAKER_00]: But I feel a deeper emotional connection with hundreds of women than I, like it's just not the same. I feel deep emotional connection with like you know the males in my family and like a partner.

[00:29:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Do you know, does that make sense?

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, well absolutely. I think it's just, I think this too is like a really fluid thing. It does remind me what comes up for me is the international organization called Gender Equity and Reconciliation International.

[00:29:22] [SPEAKER_01]: And what they do is they facilitate healing of the gender wounds. And it's really beautiful. They bring together men and women, and the men can be heterosexual, they could be gay men, doesn't matter, but it is sort of like a biology thing I guess.

[00:29:39] [SPEAKER_01]: And then they also have the men, people who identify as men, other people identify as women. And then the women will go, not always but often they go first and the men make a circle around them and just hold space and they're silent.

[00:29:53] [SPEAKER_01]: And the women then start sharing stories about their gender wound. And then they do the opposite and then the men go sit down and talk and the women hold space for them so that the women get to hear, and this is how we can hold space for both of both of our wounds.

[00:30:09] [SPEAKER_01]: The other thing that I just think about is like, is sisterhood, does sisterhood have to do with the split off feminine right which isn't about women. It really is about this piece of us that we all have.

[00:30:22] [SPEAKER_01]: So what if there are not you because you have found your little niche but just generally speaking like can sisterhood, you know involve women and men who are needs support because you know who's the best at belittling men who aren't masculine enough other men.

[00:30:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Right and so those men, in fact my other colleague Dr. Sean Miller told me about research where men overestimate the sexism of the men around them. Meaning that yeah so meaning that here's a man he's a quality man he's like married to a strong woman he's like I'm not threatened by my by women's equality, but he will assume that the men around him even his own friends and colleagues are more sexist than he is then they actually are.

[00:31:14] [SPEAKER_01]: So think about those men if that man could like step up and take a chance to be vulnerable and be more outspoken about equality, that maybe that's the permission structure that those other men need and so that's such a sin.

[00:31:31] [SPEAKER_01]: That's why I call the patriarchal wound that men carry more sinister. There's this unspoken thing that men actually some men aren't even as sexist as we think they are, but they have to pretend to be sexist because the other men because they fear being belittled by other men.

[00:31:49] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's crazy.

[00:31:50] [SPEAKER_01]: So, so that's why I'm thinking like those men. It's almost like a kind of sisterhood well I mean brotherhood but kind of a sisterhood if sisterhood has to do with like supporting our reconnection with the feminine and brotherhood has to do with, I don't know supporting a reconnection with the masculine.

[00:32:08] [SPEAKER_01]: It's just fun to think about different ways to.

[00:32:11] [SPEAKER_00]: There's some, yeah there's, there's something really interesting in that like if I need to reconnect or want to reconnect more with my masculine. It's very easy to do that to other women right like there's a certain girlfriends that I can call and they'll be like yeah you go

[00:32:24] [SPEAKER_00]: like give me all the rah rah rah like very like, go out, get it, achieve it and it's easy as a woman to get that message in society, if I want it if I need it right.

[00:32:34] [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't think there's that same ability out there for men to be like oh man I need to like, I need to connect with my feelings.

[00:32:43] [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm going to call up my body.

[00:32:45] [SPEAKER_00]: They don't, they don't have the ability to do that generally I mean I think some men maybe have some close friendships but but I believe I've come across a few studies that like acknowledge that men just do not have the emotional friendship connections

[00:33:02] [SPEAKER_01]: and network that women just naturally are able to create for themselves. Yeah, and I kind of think like women, certain women might be ahead in this sort of journey that they are not only we've been friends

[00:33:15] [SPEAKER_01]: but we've been forced to come into relationship with our masculine, and now we are taking back our feminine and we are finding this power that maybe we're going to be really important in helping men do that.

[00:33:26] [SPEAKER_01]: And so just something interesting to think about so I love it. Thanks for engaging in that question so so let's talk more about I guess your services and let's talk about touchless orgasm.

[00:33:38] [SPEAKER_01]: And, yeah, let's let's just talk more about that maybe there's, you know, you could share like, I don't know, a couple of things to get people to think about about what about this touchless orgasm and I talked in the intro about sort of what it is

[00:33:57] [SPEAKER_01]: it's the ability to I mean I at this point I think it's, it always shocks me that people don't realize that they can feel pleasure and orgasmic just being still not being with anybody or just imagine imagining something so you know how, like, how did, how did you come up with that

[00:34:15] [SPEAKER_01]: was it by accident for me I have my own experience of like having a spiritual orgasm I was like what the heck just happened to me and I got to keep that a secret because people are going to think I'm crazy.

[00:34:25] [SPEAKER_01]: But, and now I'm like, Oh, of course I could just sit here and feel pleasure.

[00:34:29] [SPEAKER_01]: And, and my spiritual orgasm done in solitude can, it can never come. I mean no be having an orgasm with a man I know will never compete with that with that.

[00:34:40] [SPEAKER_01]: So it also is a different kind of experience because you're actually connecting with not only a deeper part of yourself but that's the bridge to the divine. So of course having a spiritual orgasm is going to be more powerful than any fallible human being so yeah so

[00:34:57] [SPEAKER_01]: So just introduce my listeners to this concept of touchless orgasm.

[00:35:03] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I had my, my very first experience my early 20s in my sleep and our sex education is sorely lacking so I knew that men had like you know what dreams and what have you but I didn't know that there was a thing for woman.

[00:35:19] [SPEAKER_00]: And so I talked to my friends and they're like what, what are you talking about. They're like, Are you sure you weren't just rubbing one out in your sleep and you didn't know and I was like no I didn't know it was completely touchless like it just happened.

[00:35:32] [SPEAKER_00]: And I don't have them very often.

[00:35:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And I had nowhere to put that so I kind of just like, you know, parked in the back of my park. Yeah.

[00:35:41] [SPEAKER_00]: And then as I started sort of getting into more formal sexuality studies, I was like, like there's something going on like you know we talked about the brain being the most powerful sex organ which I do think is very true in a lot of ways.

[00:35:55] [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, if I can do it in my sleep there must be a way for me to learn how to do it when I'm awake but I had no idea nowhere to start. And so that thought idea sort of just languished for years until my most recent coaching training in 2022 where we started doing a lot of somatic work a lot of

[00:36:17] [SPEAKER_00]: sort of healing our own wounds individually in various practices and tools and meditations and what have you. And I was like, oh, like and that part woke up right I was like oh I'm doing these pleasure practices and I'm starting to feel pleasure before I'm touching myself or have my vibrate road or anything and I was like, Oh yeah that thing that has always kind of been living inside me for a long time I was like, Hey friend, are you coming out to play.

[00:36:43] [SPEAKER_00]: And it was in community at the retreat part of the course twice. One was in a Yoni egg session. So I did have something inserted but the other experience was just with breath work practice.

[00:37:00] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, so I'm laying there on my yoga mat like hands at my sides and I'm like, Oh my God, it is real. It can happen. And it didn't happen because I needed 10 more minutes, but it just that experience and I could hear there were women around me who were absolutely having orgasms and were clearly deep deep in their pleasure.

[00:37:16] [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody was as far as I know I wasn't watching anybody nobody was watching me.

[00:37:19] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think the vast majority of us in those sessions were touchless.

[00:37:24] [SPEAKER_00]: And so then I was like fired up and I got home and I was like, Is this real can I replicate this at home without the energy of all these women with me in community.

[00:37:36] [SPEAKER_00]: And I found that I could and it for me it's almost like once your body sort of you know how to do it consciously like it's there.

[00:37:44] [SPEAKER_00]: And so I started teaching it to, you know, small groups of women, and they've all reported they're like, Yep, I can connect with this pleasure I can build this pleasure.

[00:37:55] [SPEAKER_00]: It is I find.

[00:37:59] [SPEAKER_00]: I think the biggest challenge for a lot of women can be to tip over from having built that pleasure into orgasm, which for me too it's not always still consistent and sometimes it's fine it's like it doesn't matter I've built this like amazing like pleasure through my whole body if I don't quite tip over.

[00:38:12] [SPEAKER_00]: That's fine. And it feels like a different orgasm, because it's from your building it from the inside out right as opposed to the outside in.

[00:38:23] [SPEAKER_00]: And it's just, I, I've.

[00:38:28] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:38:29] [SPEAKER_01]: I love. Well, you know, I love that and you know it has to do with us being receptive.

[00:38:37] [SPEAKER_01]: Right so inside out I would say is is like a feminine thing as opposed to the outside. I mean they're both lovely right and then I mean also you bring up something and I have a story the first time I happened to me but you know you bring up.

[00:38:51] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, now I forgot what you just brought up so I'll share my story so I was, I had gotten divorced and I got swept up and the most ironic weird romance that I just had to.

[00:39:05] [SPEAKER_01]: So, once you start exploring like when you have a midlife unraveling unit start exploring like how did I get myself here and why do I think that way and all that sort of stuff.

[00:39:14] [SPEAKER_01]: Once you start healing some of those wounds then the doorway opens up for the bigger forces that transcend you, the archetypal energies that really want to use you. And so I got swept up and one of those those romances that like, I look at it now I'm like, oh, I did that like cringe, but I would never ever not have done it because it is really what brought me into very deep connection with not only the feminine but the crossing the bridge to the divine to the transcendent.

[00:39:42] [SPEAKER_01]: So the first time I was with what what started this is this man. I had dated him for let's say it was like four weeks six weeks and I'm like when are we gonna have sex when am I going to have sex like we, we but we are so physical and the affection and the kissing was like it was totally enough

[00:39:59] [SPEAKER_01]: it was so arousing but soon I wanted more and on the night I thought I was going to get more he's like, I have something to share with you I feel conflicted having sex outside of marriage.

[00:40:12] [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like in my head going you're 33 what what 33 old guy like has a conflict having sex outside of marriage and and he's like do you still want to hang out with me and I'm like yeah, but it was like devastating to me because I had just found my healthy sexuality post divorce and I'm like, no, like I'm an open faucet now.

[00:40:29] [SPEAKER_01]: But what was so interesting is given that given that that was now out of bounds, is when I started.

[00:40:37] [SPEAKER_01]: I call it sort of exploring the world of no sex sex which is kind of what we're talking about. And so one day he was over and you know we were like taking a nap I wasn't actually napping and he we were had our shirts off our pants on and he was laying on the bed and I was just laying on top of them.

[00:40:55] [SPEAKER_01]: And he fell asleep and I was just so relaxed and so just there was some skin touch. And suddenly there was this image in my imagination of him between my legs and pleasuring me and and of course I'm just laying there and I'm like, oh like I'm really getting aroused and I'm totally still.

[00:41:14] [SPEAKER_01]: There's no movement. He's napping and this image of him between my legs starts to arouse me. Well, then his image turns into a snake.

[00:41:24] [SPEAKER_01]: A giant serpent. And I feel this like, oh, like I'm constricting because I'm like, that's between my legs. And so there's this this little battle going on inside like that is wrong, but no I need to allow the serpent to enter me.

[00:41:40] [SPEAKER_01]: It was a Kundalini experience. So the serpent, which actually is the symbol for goddess before there was a word for goddess right enters me and if I would I didn't orgasm but if I would have moved, I totally would have exploded and that like busted my brain.

[00:41:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Literally I didn't tell anybody for it's I mean it's in my coming memoir but it was a while before I told anybody because I thought like you like what what is this and because I was studying depth psychology, the symbolism I really did feel that I touched the ancient feminine.

[00:42:16] [SPEAKER_01]: That is how I wrote about it in my journaling. So, yeah, I mean, I think this you know why I said in my intro Why wouldn't it be arousing and pleasurable to come into deep relationship with yourself.

[00:42:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And then once you cross over and connect with the divine and you feel union with the divine. Why wouldn't that be pleasurable, why would we want to say that's wrong.

[00:42:42] [SPEAKER_01]: So I love it. I love the work that you do because you specifically specialize in that. So what I read on your website, which I thought, you know, you know, you know what, why do people come to you and one of the, you know, the reasons that you had listed was pain that some women are experiencing

[00:43:02] [SPEAKER_01]: pain during sex and of course we always want a medical explanation but there's always a psycho spiritual aspect to all of our body issues. And in fact I always like to promote Megan chance she's a feminist Christian who sort of recovered from her indoctrination and she has a podcast called

[00:43:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Reclaiming feminism for Christianity, and she pointed out research that there is really a connection between being indoctrinated with rigid religious beliefs around what women are supposed to feel and not what the proper role of sex is.

[00:43:39] [SPEAKER_01]: And then later on them feeling pain and sex having fertility problems having other problems because of the rigidity and not really being able to be in touch with a part of themselves. So I don't know if you want to touch on that but you had that listed and so you know maybe you can just share like what are some of the reasons that people come to you and then I don't know happens when you work with them.

[00:44:02] [SPEAKER_00]: We spend a lot more time on what's underneath there's always something underneath that's in the way of you accessing the orgasm they want you want the pleasure you want the sex life you want so we spend a lot of time looking at what's underneath that.

[00:44:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and what a well yeah what a great first step like oh I can't even deal with like another body but just having learning self intimacy. Yeah.

[00:44:25] [SPEAKER_01]: And do they and do they like when they're coming to you.

[00:44:30] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I would assume that people who come to already are intuitively realize that. But is that surprising to some people when you say, oh it's really not about, you know, this physical.

[00:44:45] [SPEAKER_00]: I have to lead them to it.

[00:44:47] [SPEAKER_00]: You know, so yeah so we start the first couple sessions are. So it's a huge, it's a huge insight for them then probably that in and of itself is kind of, yeah, it's, I mean I have one client who I asked, I asked her questions and she'll just kind of sit there and be like, huh.

[00:45:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[00:45:09] [SPEAKER_00]: You know because she's never looked at it from that perspective so you know or, you know, we do a certain exercise and we're, you know, we're almost every session we're going into the body like working in the body what's there what's in the way, what's happening, and inevitably

[00:45:23] [SPEAKER_00]: like something will come up and they're like, oh, they learn something that's in the way or they realize something that's in the way so it's sort of taking them through.

[00:45:34] [SPEAKER_00]: You know whatever I feel is most appropriate for their specific situation through the various tools so that they can organically start to excavate like what is in the way like why can't you have an orgasm for penetration like what's happening, is it physical is there something else.

[00:45:50] [SPEAKER_00]: And it's usually something else.

[00:45:52] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[00:45:53] [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so you used to have this resource called three keys yes touch this orgasm. Do you, I mean are you willing to share one of those keys or like give people something specific that they can go ruminate about or try.

[00:46:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, here is anybody is listening to this and is like, I want to get started on this right away.

[00:46:14] [SPEAKER_00]: Quick and easiest way is to just start your own process of reconnection. So I recommend before you get out of bed, and before you go to sleep at night.

[00:46:23] [SPEAKER_00]: You just do a meditation, wherever you are you can still be in bed lying down.

[00:46:29] [SPEAKER_00]: And you're not going to empty your mind in a traditional meditation you want to do that to a certain extent but you really want to put your put your awareness onto your genitals like what do you feel what is alive.

[00:46:40] [SPEAKER_00]: And if you almost like if you think at your genitals, and nothing else for a while.

[00:46:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Does it start to change does awareness, they'll perk up. Yeah, doesn't wear does awareness invites sensation doesn't awareness pleasure right and it comes back again to that stillness like we're just going to be still there and release expectations

[00:47:02] [SPEAKER_00]: right because you're just trying to see what you can sense there.

[00:47:06] [SPEAKER_00]: The other thing is, when you're doing it morning and night.

[00:47:09] [SPEAKER_00]: If you do it for, I would say to do it for least a week I think you should do it every day I do it every day like before I go to bed I'm like, what's happening pussy what, what are we doing today.

[00:47:18] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think one of the things that people sort of don't realize is that our pleasure is really responsive to practice right we can teach our pleasure how to behave to a certain extent, we can train ourselves so that we are able to connect with what we're feeling much

[00:47:35] [SPEAKER_00]: easier much quicker like if I focus like as we started talking about this.

[00:47:40] [SPEAKER_00]: I immediately put my awareness on my pussy and I'm like, oh she's warm and she's tingly like she's.

[00:47:46] [SPEAKER_00]: He's kind of alive right now like if I had a partner she would probably want to have sex and it's just this like, it becomes second nature to just check in.

[00:47:54] [SPEAKER_00]: And the flip side I find to happen to me a few times is I, I've gone on a date from whatever online dating out but it's been a while since I've been on but like Tinder or whatever show up to the date and pussy has been like slam shut.

[00:48:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Don't want to have sex with this guy, not because there was anything wrong with him. He was a nice guy plate as your body knows the truth of the situation bodies like bodies like he's not the one for us.

[00:48:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Right. So if you get in depth just that simple practice morning and night lying in stillness in bed, put your awareness on your genitals.

[00:48:31] [SPEAKER_00]: What sensations are already there, and then you just start to see if you can invite more and more sensation is that's the first step that everybody can do costs nothing except a little bit of time every morning.

[00:48:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, I love that. And I love just the question. Does my awareness lead to sensation. I mean that's really powerful and I'm going to share my link I actually did.

[00:48:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I'd love for you to share this too. I actually did a meditation it's a self intimacy meditation and it includes reflections about the deeper meaning of arousal and attraction.

[00:49:11] [SPEAKER_01]: And then I also like, ask, just say you know if you want to lay someplace if you want to be naked you want to be dressed you want to whatever just lay. And it was the same thing like bringing attention like, oh, is there heat between that down there and like, Oh, what's that about.

[00:49:31] [SPEAKER_01]: So it actually like I created a meditation exactly for that. And then also, you know we do neuro neurologically speaking we know that the brain doesn't know the difference between reality and fantasy and imagination and imagination and the image actually is the language of the unconscious.

[00:49:50] [SPEAKER_01]: And so our spontaneous fantasies we talked a little bit about this last time, they are asking for us to explore something and sometimes we assign meaning that is not the right meaning. So for example I often, I getting aroused doesn't always mean you want to have sex right so in my situation with that man.

[00:50:10] [SPEAKER_01]: It wasn't going to lead to penetration. So one of the things that was really lovely was developing the capacity for sustained arousal without climax.

[00:50:21] [SPEAKER_01]: It's cool.

[00:50:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Like to be able to be aroused and not rush to some sort of conclusion that we assume is the natural conclusion or maybe we do it later, but maybe like just being in sustained arousal with someone is pretty like amazing.

[00:50:36] [SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, it just makes sense. So you can go at this from a psychological standpoint, a physical standpoint and neuro it's all the same conclusion that you really can feel pleasure from the inside out, and you don't, you don't even need to touch yourself.

[00:50:55] [SPEAKER_01]: Although that can be lovely too so.

[00:50:57] [SPEAKER_00]: And that's my absolute favorite favorite thing is that the brain doesn't know the difference.

[00:51:03] [SPEAKER_00]: It's fascinating. So I've so I touched on that I've actually written a book, which is going to replace the three keys that you just mentioned, where it's going to be $5, I give you, and I tell you the whole system I give you the background, how it all works the body, the body the mind and then

[00:51:20] [SPEAKER_00]: the pleasure building element, and there's 19 tools in the book. So anybody that wants to get started you can get the full system for five bucks on my website.

[00:51:31] [SPEAKER_00]: So that that should be that should be. I've had all the tech gremlins this week so well assuming that I've got them all kinked out kinks out.

[00:51:40] [SPEAKER_01]: You just let me know yeah right. Yes I love it you just let me know and then I'll then we'll post this so.

[00:51:49] [SPEAKER_01]: That's great. Well, I have loved this chat, I'm sure we're gonna have another one, because I got to talk about this at least quarterly. I mean I just I just need to I got to get my fix so is there anything else that you want to add or other thoughts or anything that came up, you know, or anything

[00:52:07] [SPEAKER_01]: that came up or any other stories we, you know, we want to share, or I mean this. This is real and it's in one of the things I said in the intro was that, you know, for people who may be during our chat to pay attention to their emotions about our chat.

[00:52:23] [SPEAKER_01]: Right, and that your emotions are an invitation to explore something so especially if there was like, oh, oh cringe I can't imagine do it like there's that's the door. That's the door to someplace amazing to explore so I just said hang in there.

[00:52:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Hang in there till we get to the end and you know you might not even be ready for touchless orgasm but you're maybe you're ready to explore like why do I feel the way that I do about even the topic.

[00:52:52] [SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, so and then and then in that case you might be ready, ready for me and then I hand you off to hand you.

[00:52:59] [SPEAKER_01]: We can partner together.

[00:53:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we write that down.

[00:53:02] [SPEAKER_01]: We even need to talk about that so yeah so yeah anything else that you want to add and oh do you want people to find I know they'll get up on your email list when they go claim that that or, you know, pay for the $5 book but like where else do you want, you know, where else do you want people

[00:53:18] [SPEAKER_00]: to check you out. I'm on Instagram and YouTube.

[00:53:22] [SPEAKER_00]: I put some.

[00:53:24] [SPEAKER_00]: There's some great practices that I put on YouTube my shame gasm is the newest one which is a really great tool to deal with that little shame monster when they pop up.

[00:53:35] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think the last sort of thought to leave listeners with would be.

[00:53:41] [SPEAKER_00]: We're here to enjoy and to feel good like there's no, there's no great mystery, I don't think. And so if somebody is listening to it and is going orgasms too much can't do it.

[00:53:54] [SPEAKER_00]: I would encourage you to engage with something that you feel good about like if it's just going if you're a terrible artist but you just love the feel of a brush on a easel, go paint or go dance or go do whatever just gives you pleasure just for the sake of

[00:54:11] [SPEAKER_00]: enjoying pleasure like it's so nourishing to just allow yourself to experience pleasure, just because you're alive and we're human and we all deserve it.

[00:54:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely. And especially those things who oh yeah because you always have that voice like well you're not an artist well that's why they have paint bars now. Yeah, you can drink and paint so you don't have to be a good painter you can just like have fun.

[00:54:35] [SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's a great message. I think that's a great message. Joe bringing joy back that's the theme these days so beautiful. Awesome. Well, thank you so much for coming back to dose of depth podcast.

[00:54:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for having me it's always such a great conversation and I hope we're going to dive in a few more times because there's so much to unwind still. Definitely. So listeners, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Jen Wodke pleasure and orgasm coach, whatever

[00:55:04] [SPEAKER_01]: If your emotions came up during our conversation, consider them an invitation to explore, especially if your thoughts and feelings were those of guilt and shame or even judgment and anger towards our chat like who are these ladies audaciously audaciously talking about

[00:55:20] [SPEAKER_01]: sex and pleasure. It's all good. Emotions are just one of many ways our unconscious is speaking to us all the time. If you'd like to explore the deeper meaning of what's going on for you sexually, and how that's intertwined with your spiritual and psychological journey, go to my website,

[00:55:35] [SPEAKER_01]: Deborah look at it, calm and schedule an exploratory chat, we'll see where it goes. And if you're ready for Jen, definitely I'll have those links in the description box go take advantage of her wisdom and knowledge and experience. And also, if you've enjoyed this episode or you enjoy my podcast in general, would you consider becoming a supporter either with a one time donation or a monthly donation as well include that link to so until next time.

[00:56:05] [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host Deborah Luka bitch, and you were listening to dose of depth podcast to get updates on new episodes my writing and how I teach my clients to get to know that deeper part of themselves. Go to Deborah Luca bitch.com. Oh, and if you're not ready for a coach, learn what my clients know in my book, your soul is talking. Are you listening? Five steps to uncovering your hidden purpose. You can check it out on my website or get it on Amazon.